My Sunfire CRS-3C's installed and playing!

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Miko1971
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My Sunfire CRS-3C's installed and playing!

Post by Miko1971 » Thu Sep 29, 2016 7:59 pm

Hello!

Since my SoundLabs are going to be down for awhile, i decided to mount my 2 CRS-3C's on the wall and use them for my main L & R. I was able to pick up another BNIB CRS-3C last week and i intend to use them as a dual center channel, one above my TV and the other below it. Pics anyone? excuse the mess, I'm single and Alpha male... I really didn't pay much attention to the finish on these speakers till tonight, they are pretty cool when you get up close. from the cheap seats you can't appreciate how deep and beautiful they are.
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kingman
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Re: My Sunfire CRS-3C's installed and playing!

Post by kingman » Fri Sep 30, 2016 6:14 am

Bet those sound nice! =D>
In reality, it only matters what it sounds like to YOU!!!

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Don
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Re: My Sunfire CRS-3C's installed and playing!

Post by Don » Fri Sep 30, 2016 7:20 am

Yep. Spill the beans, how do they sound?
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Miko1971
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Re: My Sunfire CRS-3C's installed and playing!

Post by Miko1971 » Fri Sep 30, 2016 10:48 am

Hello Friends,

I was up till 2am enjoying them! Even though my rather antiquated bag end sub has a fixed crossover of 95hz they sound very nice indeed. I tried the grills off for awhile because of the built in wave guide in this configuration directs the sound up and down instead of to the sides.Then i put them on and i like they way they sound. Incredible sound stage and playing with the room boundary switch helped integrate the sub better. I understand why they retail for $1,200 or so now.

I can also understand the line source concept compared to my soundlabs. I bet if i was to run 3 on each side from floor to ceiling, i would be satisfied. As they are brand new, i did notice the mid bass was a little thin. Or maybe it's because i can't blend them in with my sub ( it has no controls at all) better. One cool aspect, because these are designed as centers they have a feature on the way cool mounting brackets ( which also have neat little mini level bubbles on them ) the ability to adjust them up or down. Mounted this way, the adjustments allow you to toe them in or straight out. These are quite the speaker and of course the fit and finish, completeness/quality of mounting hardware and so on is beyond reproach.

I was using the EQ functions of my various music players to adjust what i could and as with all things music, some stuff sounded a hell of a lot better then others. the sense of spaciousness and channel separation is excellent.

My current set up is:
2 sunfire 300's bridged
my HP PC running J River out to a Firefly DAC
Bag End Infrasub 18
2 CRS-3C's

Given the fact that these are designed to be center channel speakers, i can't see why they can't work as main L & R speakers full time. If i was to build or just have a multi media / home theater that didn't want huge speakers everywhere, i would be happy running this set up. another one or two for the center and the surrounds.

Being as they are bolted to the wall, i was not expecting this level of sound quality. I am impressed and Bob Carvers genius once again literally pisses in the face of conventional dogma. I use the Eagles Farewell tour dvd, specifically "In the city" as a reference track and i was reminded of my Original Amazing's in terms of dynamic scope and sheer sonic range.

Having said that, are they as capable of filling the room with the kind of sound my SL's do? no..but that is not a fair comparison. I would bet that the new Carver line sources would probably trounce my SL's and give me back some real estate.

Matter of fact, this little experiment has confirmed what i feared all along. I am definitely going to buy a pair of ALS speakers now. The line between Ribbons and stats is so thin as to be a moot point in my opinion.

I also learned or rather confirmed another idea. I intend on continuing to use a PC for a source component. I have been playing around with this idea for at least 10 years now. Is anyone familiar with Mark Levinson's new company Daniel Hertz SA?

He has created a "digital" version of the Unobtainium level Cello Audio Palette and incorporated it into a MAC OS based music player known as Master Class.

https://www.danielhertz.com/master-class-software

I'm going to put together a MAC Mini based music server and run that as the main player. I think that will sound great. And as an added bonus..it's affordable..relatively speaking when talking about ML and his offerings.



More thoughts to come...

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Re: My Sunfire CRS-3C's installed and playing!

Post by Jazzman53 » Fri Sep 30, 2016 12:21 pm

Miko1971 wrote:Hello!

Since my SoundLabs are going to be down for awhile....
Just curious about your Soundlabs. What model and what's the problem with them?

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Miko1971
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Re: My Sunfire CRS-3C's installed and playing!

Post by Miko1971 » Fri Sep 30, 2016 1:58 pm

They are the non PX 90 degree A1's. I am sending the electronic back plates to SoundLab for updating. SL was started as a research and patent company. In that tradition, when you purchase a pair of speakers, you are buying the current state of the art at that time and investing into the company to allow them to develop new products. Then new technology and upgrades are made available to you to update and keep your speakers performing at the next level. I choose to keep my "old style" Non PX panels because i like the 90 degree dispersion pattern. The PX's have a 45 degree. Just before i bought these, the cores were shipped to SL and completely rebuilt with new Mylar etc..PX refers to the new "Professional level" cores with higher power capability and so forth. I've run mine with 4 Sunfire's in mono bypassing the mixing boards and i can say that they can play and use 1,200 watts no problem. That is the closest approximation the Dead's "Wall of Sound" I've ever heard.

I think everyone who loves music and the Equipment we use, owes it themselves to listen to a high powered SoundLab set up.
i can only say that it is a concert like effect and engulfing / incredible would be words i use to try and explain that experience.

Mine were made in 2004, since that time they have come up with a toroidal transformer and increased the bias/sensitivity of the speakers. Also, the passive parts i.e. caps and resisters etc... have been evaluated and updated to the newest and best performing types.

They offer these upgrades separately, you can get the Consummate upgrade which involves the transformers and the Hot Rod where the Solen caps are replaced with very high quality Jensen paper-in-oil caps. The inductor is replaced by a much heavier gauge Madisound Sledgehammer unit and the resistors are imported 1% tolerance Sfernice thick-film non-inductive units. Plus small updates and of course, i have to wave my magic wand and have a few custom tweaks. Silver WBT Binding posts, Neutrik PowerCon a/c inlet and Silver wiring throughout. Hand matched cap values etc....

It is around $2K per speaker to do both factory upgrades...not a bad deal considering they are $31K for a brand new pair.

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jjptkd
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Re: My Sunfire CRS-3C's installed and playing!

Post by jjptkd » Fri Sep 30, 2016 7:55 pm

Nice! I know a few people who use those as L C R's with good results. Sub matching is critical to get the best out of them, something from 30hz - 125hz in stereo with an additional LFE for the low sub 30hz works best.

FWIW the CRS-3's use the same exact mounting brackets, key is to mount them so that the ribbons are ear level then toe them in and out as per taste. It does take some time for not only the woofers to break in but the ribbons as well, they will open up quite a bit and sound a lot better. I believe the manual states 300 hours? Can't remember for sure.

These things will gobble up the power too, I ran mine bi-amped with a 400x5 and they just took it all and sounded great.
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Miko1971
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Re: My Sunfire CRS-3C's installed and playing!

Post by Miko1971 » Sat Oct 01, 2016 9:05 am

Yea, the brackets are cool. I've never owned speakers that you can mount on the wall. My idea is to incorporate my 2 ch with a 7.4.1 home theater. I will use my SL's as my main L & R, so when I upgrade my TV to a wall mount I wanted to run both of these CR'a above and below it to help match my SL's.

I don't know if anyone has tried a dual center channel from what I've learned, that is the most important channel for movies. Then 4 of the bipole surrounds and 4 subrosa's in/near each corner of the room.

Shake-n-Bake baby!! Maybe.....I'm still researching this and it's going to require the help of my contractor buddy, do a infinitely baffled E.L.F. sub and port that bitch under the house / crawl space. Was thinking of a manifold along the side wall. Sorta like this:
image.jpeg
image.jpeg (26.73 KiB) Viewed 2061 times
.
24 inch and it would only be a couple foot tall.

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