elgrau, your PC challenge is here.

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treitz3
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elgrau, your PC challenge is here.

Post by treitz3 » Wed Jan 28, 2009 12:30 am

You know, the power cord challenge that you have in your signature. I'm back and I'm ready to discuss it once again. Give me the challenge without reference to the long ass thread but just the challenge. Like I said, I'll take you up on it. My ears are here, willing and able and I'm at the point to where I can make it happen.

Talk to me.

Here's your sig.........

"Arguing about this is stupid. Your anecdotal evidence proves nothing.
SHOW ME THE RESULTS OF MY PROPOSED BLIND LISTENING TEST REGARDING THE PERCEIVED EFFECT OF UPGRADED POWER CORDS ON SYSTEM SOUND."


Let me prove to you that it's not perceived even though I already have, but not to your liking.

All I want to know is the challenge. That's it. Nothing more, nothing less. My ears are ready.
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Re: elgrau, your PC challenge is here.

Post by elgrau » Wed Jan 28, 2009 2:22 am

Copied with minor edits from last year's post:

Treitz3,
Ok, here's my blind test for effect (if any) of $800 PC:
1. The system used is your choice (yours, someone else's). Obviously, the better the system, the more likely you are to hear a difference (theoretically).
2. If no "quick disconnect" plug on the amp (and PC's): Then on chosen system, install both the ORIGINAL power cord (or exact same replacement cord) AND the "$800 PC" to the amp side. During the test, either cord will then be plugged into the outlet (but not both at the same time). If "quick disconnect", then both PC's plugged into outlet and then (obviously) switched back and forth at the amp side.
3. Pick any 20 different songs of any genre (or mixed genre). If this effect is non-existant, then choice of songs is immaterial.
4. Location of test (and quality of listening room) is your choice.
5. Test to be conducted and scored by a nuetral, independent 3rd party plus witness. Preferrably someone from a hi-fi publication, hi-fi manufactor, or hi-fi seller, unknown by the test subject(s). Test conductor is to be well versed in audiophile equipment and issues related to hi-fi.
6. Test conductor, witness, amp, PC, and power outlet to be 100% visually shielded from test subject(s). Latter especially important if no "quick disconnect" and PC's have to be switched during the test at this outlet.
7. Test to commence with test subject(s) seated in listening position and test conductor seated behind shield with witness and with amp, PC, and power source. Test conductor to flip a genuine u.s. coin (to be used throughout test) and if heads ("heads" for chosen coin to be decided upon at this time and consistent throughout test), connect amp to outlet using the baseline PC that originally came with the test amp; if tails, use the $800 PC. Test conductor (with witness looking on and witnessing all subsequent actions and recordings of test conductor throughout test duration) to silently record results of coin flip on a clipboard with lines numbered 1 through 20. Preamp volumn to be limited to a maximum ~75% of full output (or less) throughout entire test. Test conductor to then play song #1.
8. After song is finished playing (or test subject(s) says he has heard enough of the song), test conductor is to switch to the other PC and re-play the song, again to end of song or until test subject(s) says that he has heard enough.
9. Test conductor then asks test subject(s) to identify which playing had the $800 PC (first or second playing of song) and record this answer(s) beside the heads or tails record for that song.
10. Repeat steps 7 through 9 for remaining 19 songs.
11. At completion of test, test conductor to score the test as follows: for every "heads" entry with a subsequent "the #2 playing used $800 PC" recorded response from test subject(s) OR "tails" entry with a subsequent "the #1 playing used $800 PC" scores a "right". Anything else scores a "wrong" for that line/song for that test subject.
12. Test conductor to count up the number of "right"'s for each test subject and report this number on this forum and sign and date (along with witness) the scoring sheet (with a listing of song titles used in the test) and mail to myself (address to be provided).
13. If desired, as many as five test subjects may participate simultaneously in this blind test with each test subject each having a response column on the clip board record. Each test subject to be scored individually and there number reported in the same manner as test subject #1. Songs to be played to completion or until all test subjects agree that they have heard enough of the song.

That's it; as stated, only conduct this test for the benefit (and desire) of the truth of this issue; not mine. My interest is purely scientific; I'm content either way. And I will abide by the results provided that the test is conducted as described.

Ed
FR: 400 disk changer with PS Audio Digital Link III DAC; Technics SL-1100A TT. QED Quenx1 IC's from DAC & TT to Adcom GTP-602 preamp/Tuner. AudioQuest King Cobra IC's from preamp to M1.0t mk-II opt2. QED Silver Spirals 4M wires to EPI 1000’s.
LR: AudioEngine wireless link from family room preamp to Barcus-Berry 2002R Sonic Maximizer to GlowPower Zyxt IC's to Sunfire 300x2 to Nordost 6M bi-source wires to AOS 28" MDF spherical speakers using six 6.5" woofers and eight 1" dome tweeters symm. arranged around the surface.
SS system: CX-995V DVD to AV-634x 3-4 channel amp (center/rears) & M1.0t mk-II opt2(fronts).
Garage: 300 disk changer to Entech 202.5 DAC to MXR150 Receiver (pre) to TFM-42 to EPI 400 speakers.

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Re: elgrau, your PC challenge is here.

Post by TNRabbit » Wed Jan 28, 2009 3:30 am

Fuck me it's back....



:-# :-" :D
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Re: elgrau, your PC challenge is here.

Post by F1nut » Wed Jan 28, 2009 3:33 am

TNRabbit wrote:Fuck me it's back....



:-# :-" :D
Hehe......exactly what I was thinking.
Political Correctness...defined

A doctrine fostered by a delusional, illogical minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end.



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Re: elgrau, your PC challenge is here.

Post by TNRabbit » Wed Jan 28, 2009 9:21 am

I'll save everyone a lot of time & give the abbreviated version of where this thread is headed:

treitz3: Power cords make a difference because I've heard it!
elgrau: Prove it.
treitz3: You are a fucktard & no one else in the world has my golden ears.
elgrau: I refuse to believe you unless you do EXACTLY as I've outlined above.
treitz3: Kiss my ass you fucking fucktarded fucktard.
elgrau: If you're going to resort to name calling, I'm outta here.
treitz3: I knew you didn't have the balls to do this, you fucktard.
elgrau: I have the balls to do it but you refuse to observe the stated criteria.
treitz3: eff off you effer; you're talking out of you ass.
elgrau: That's REAL mature. I've repeatedly blah blah blah blah blah
treitz3: fucking fucktarded tard blah blah
elgrau: blah blah blah
treitz3: blah blah fucktard blah blah motherfucker blah blah blah
elgrau: blah blah blah blah blah blah blind testing blah blah blah

....ad infinitum....


:D :D :D :D :D :D
TNRabbit
Image

From FrankieD's lips to your ears: Sunfire - a quiet box of endless power.

Sunfire TG-IV/400~7 Amp
Carver SD/A-360 CDP
Benchmark DAC-1
Sony SACD/DVD-A
Active bi-amp: Ashly XR-1001 & 2 Rane PEQ-15s
Main: HotRodded AL-IIIs
Sub: Klipsch RT-12d
Center: Sunfire CRS-3c
Surround: Sunfire CRS-3 (x 2)

OconeeOrange wrote:"Gary likes to play it 'loud' as do I. His system begs you turn it up until you die"

RIP WIlliam B. Dibble, 1948-2012. I'll miss you my friend.

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Re: elgrau, your PC challenge is here.

Post by skip » Wed Jan 28, 2009 10:37 am

^ :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
Bad Wabbit! [-X Though I think you've probably nailed it. O:)
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Re: elgrau, your PC challenge is here.

Post by Toy Maker » Wed Jan 28, 2009 11:18 am

TNRabbit wrote:I'll save everyone a lot of time & give the abbreviated version of where this thread is headed:

treitz3: Power cords make a difference because I've heard it!
elgrau: Prove it.
treitz3: You are a fucktard & no one else in the world has my golden ears.
elgrau: I refuse to believe you unless you do EXACTLY as I've outlined above.
treitz3: Kiss my ass you fucking fucktarded fucktard.
elgrau: If you're going to resort to name calling, I'm outta here.
treitz3: I knew you didn't have the balls to do this, you fucktard.
elgrau: I have the balls to do it but you refuse to observe the stated criteria.
treitz3: eff off you effer; you're talking out of you ass.
elgrau: That's REAL mature. I've repeatedly blah blah blah blah blah
treitz3: fucking fucktarded tard blah blah
elgrau: blah blah blah
treitz3: blah blah fucktard blah blah motherfucker blah blah blah
elgrau: blah blah blah blah blah blah blind testing blah blah blah

....ad infinitum....


Anyone else want some Popcorn ?? I'm making me some, and gana sit back and watch the show !!! 8)
Sounds like it was one of Tom's GOOD nights... maybe had a couple cases backing him up already ? :lol:

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Re: elgrau, your PC challenge is here.

Post by engtaz » Wed Jan 28, 2009 12:08 pm

:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
engtaz


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Re: elgrau, your PC challenge is here.

Post by elgrau » Wed Jan 28, 2009 12:27 pm

"Fuck me it's back...."

My exact thoughts as well when I saw the post! And no, I read none of the other negativity....from Rabbit, et al.
FR: 400 disk changer with PS Audio Digital Link III DAC; Technics SL-1100A TT. QED Quenx1 IC's from DAC & TT to Adcom GTP-602 preamp/Tuner. AudioQuest King Cobra IC's from preamp to M1.0t mk-II opt2. QED Silver Spirals 4M wires to EPI 1000’s.
LR: AudioEngine wireless link from family room preamp to Barcus-Berry 2002R Sonic Maximizer to GlowPower Zyxt IC's to Sunfire 300x2 to Nordost 6M bi-source wires to AOS 28" MDF spherical speakers using six 6.5" woofers and eight 1" dome tweeters symm. arranged around the surface.
SS system: CX-995V DVD to AV-634x 3-4 channel amp (center/rears) & M1.0t mk-II opt2(fronts).
Garage: 300 disk changer to Entech 202.5 DAC to MXR150 Receiver (pre) to TFM-42 to EPI 400 speakers.

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Re: elgrau, your PC challenge is here.

Post by t-mitch4 » Wed Jan 28, 2009 12:44 pm

Hang on tight! :-"

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Re: elgrau, your PC challenge is here.

Post by BillD » Wed Jan 28, 2009 1:50 pm

Gary, it wasn't ad infinitum, it was ad nausium
It should sound like it isn't there!
There is a difference between hearing and listening...
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Re: elgrau, your PC challenge is here.

Post by F1nut » Wed Jan 28, 2009 7:08 pm

Gary....GREAT post!!!

:lol: :lol: \:D/ :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: =D> \:D/ :-" :lol:
Political Correctness...defined

A doctrine fostered by a delusional, illogical minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end.



Make America Great Again

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Re: elgrau, your PC challenge is here.

Post by elgrau » Wed Jan 28, 2009 9:50 pm

sniff-sniff....what's that smell?? Oh, it's kitty litter! Someone from the "one tit" club must have showed up! :-# :lol:
FR: 400 disk changer with PS Audio Digital Link III DAC; Technics SL-1100A TT. QED Quenx1 IC's from DAC & TT to Adcom GTP-602 preamp/Tuner. AudioQuest King Cobra IC's from preamp to M1.0t mk-II opt2. QED Silver Spirals 4M wires to EPI 1000’s.
LR: AudioEngine wireless link from family room preamp to Barcus-Berry 2002R Sonic Maximizer to GlowPower Zyxt IC's to Sunfire 300x2 to Nordost 6M bi-source wires to AOS 28" MDF spherical speakers using six 6.5" woofers and eight 1" dome tweeters symm. arranged around the surface.
SS system: CX-995V DVD to AV-634x 3-4 channel amp (center/rears) & M1.0t mk-II opt2(fronts).
Garage: 300 disk changer to Entech 202.5 DAC to MXR150 Receiver (pre) to TFM-42 to EPI 400 speakers.

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Re: elgrau, your PC challenge is here.

Post by stevewithrow » Wed Jan 28, 2009 10:55 pm

Nothing against you elgrau , but being an electrician myself and having an understanding of how electricity flows to a power transformer , I get a kick out of this thread and the old one . ampacities , derating wire , voltage drops . why copper is a better conductor then aluminum . yata yata yata . Ohms law has been real good to me . Im sure . no , Im real sure , lets say that when Mr, Carver built his amps he took Ohms law into consideration . Now with that being said , the power that goes to my outlet is as only good as the wire coming from the panel , IE..12 gage , 14 gage . Then again , I guess I could spend hundreds on a so called WELL insulated power cord...Im on crack if I think I could change the resistance or ampacities from my outlet. 120 volts on a 20 amp curcuit at 60hz is just that . I guess I could put a transformer in line after the outlet.....I dont think so , nor will I spend OR give any one my money on a bogas claim . You can also look all this up in the NEC 2008 code book . O:) I think I would rather spend 800.00 $ on another pair of AL-III,s . Maybe you do hear a differance , I know I wouldnt . heres an example . the wire going to your outlet is # 12 . Your new power cord has a # 8 ....IT WONT CHANGE NOTHING...!!!!You increase the flow (amps ) at the panel , then upsize wire from there and dedicate it . ( make sure your outlet is rated for it ) See pic below....Romex will be under the 60 degree chart
ampacities.gif
ampacities.gif (60.34 KiB) Viewed 1544 times
And the picture below is 120 volts at around 10 amps producing 5 million watts at 0 amps...How..because of the COIL...thats why coils play a HUGE part in our electronics....( there some other stuff going on with the tesla coil )
Last edited by stevewithrow on Wed Jan 28, 2009 11:21 pm, edited 3 times in total.

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Re: elgrau, your PC challenge is here.

Post by Jag_97470 » Wed Jan 28, 2009 10:58 pm

Sooo, Send me the fucking power cable to try! I will plug it in and test it with my own Golden EARS! and when you want my conclusion? I will say; fuck if I know, but thanks for the power cord!
sorry, I'm just trying to fit in.
hehe

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