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It is currently Thu Oct 30, 2014 11:42 am

Looking for suggestions for 12AU7s

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tinpan

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TFM-45

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Location: Spotsylvania, VA

Post Wed Oct 08, 2014 3:31 pm

Looking for suggestions for 12AU7s

Since I finally upgraded all of my speaker wires and interconnects and tube rolling on the Carver Baby Black Beauty was so much fun. I thought I would spend the cooler months experimenting with a little tube rolling in some of the DACS and Preamps I have.

The first one up is an Audio Notes Kit L2 Line/Phono stage. It has a pair of 12AU7s it uses for the line stage. The phone section in this has a single 6DJ8 and a single 12AT7. The power section has a 6X5 and one other one I can't remember what it is.

First up is to find a Siemons 5852. According to one of my buddies I was an idiot for not stocking up on these when they were $50...oh well.

I had a Westinghouse 6922 in the phono stage and it sounded nice but had a little noise. I replaced it with a Bugle Boy 6DJ8 I found in my tube stash and that really sounds nice, seems to have a lower noise floor.

I have tried 2 different Sylvania 12AU7's. They sound nice and are very quiet. The first was a pair labeled CONN the second were the JAN ECC82. Curious as to what else is lurking out there I can try.
Tinpan

HT - Sunfire TG IV, Sunfire Cinema Grand Sig. 400 x 5, Oppo 93, Klipsch LaScala (3), Cornwalls (2), SW-12, Sony 60" LCD

2 channel - AN L2 Pre-amp, AN Interstage Mono Blocks 300b PSE, AN 2.1 DAC, DUAL CS 5000 TT, Oppo DV-981HD, Lowther PM4a/Azurahorn/SentryIV

2 channel - AN L3 Signature Line stage, AN Interstage Mono Blocks 300b PSE, AN Sig. DAC 3.1 , AN Sig. Phono Stage, Sota Comet TT, Altec A5's

2 channel - Carver VTA20 Baby Black Beauty, Custom Line Stage, Klipschorns

2 channel - AN Interstage Mono Blocks 300b PSE, Carver C-5 Pre, Altec A4 speakers


2 channel - Audio Note Kit 1 300b SET, Audio Note DAC 2.1, Altec 288 Horns/JBL Bass bin
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Zoot Horn

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Post Wed Oct 08, 2014 7:34 pm

Re: Looking for suggestions for 12AU7s

I like the RCA cleartops
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tinpan

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TFM-45

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Joined: Tue Jan 05, 2010 7:48 am

Location: Spotsylvania, VA

Post Thu Oct 09, 2014 2:22 pm

Re: Looking for suggestions for 12AU7s

Thanks for the suggestion, I have a pair on order and a smooth plate Telefunken 12AX7. Turns out the 12AT7 is a 12AX7. The Amperex Bugle Boy 6DJ8 was very nice. The noise floor was a lot lower and it really just sounded nice.

Turns out I was able to to get Mike at Wes Tubes to sell me 6 of the Bendix ( not Siemens) 6X5's so they are on the way. That was very nice of him to give them to me at the old price. The remaining stock he has will now be $99. Now I'll have one for each unit. It's supposed to be a very nice rectifier tune. The other tube is an ECL82 which I guess regulates the voltage to the power supply.

I swapped out the Bugle Boy since I have a pair of them and will try another 6DJ8 which I think is also an Amperex. It's an HP tube. If that works I can put the pair of Bugle Boys in the DAC 2.1.

I made a spreadsheet that maps out all the different tubes the preamps and dac use. Now it's becoming a little clearer to me what is in each one.
Tinpan

HT - Sunfire TG IV, Sunfire Cinema Grand Sig. 400 x 5, Oppo 93, Klipsch LaScala (3), Cornwalls (2), SW-12, Sony 60" LCD

2 channel - AN L2 Pre-amp, AN Interstage Mono Blocks 300b PSE, AN 2.1 DAC, DUAL CS 5000 TT, Oppo DV-981HD, Lowther PM4a/Azurahorn/SentryIV

2 channel - AN L3 Signature Line stage, AN Interstage Mono Blocks 300b PSE, AN Sig. DAC 3.1 , AN Sig. Phono Stage, Sota Comet TT, Altec A5's

2 channel - Carver VTA20 Baby Black Beauty, Custom Line Stage, Klipschorns

2 channel - AN Interstage Mono Blocks 300b PSE, Carver C-5 Pre, Altec A4 speakers


2 channel - Audio Note Kit 1 300b SET, Audio Note DAC 2.1, Altec 288 Horns/JBL Bass bin
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Magnaryder

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Post Thu Oct 09, 2014 2:45 pm

Re: Looking for suggestions for 12AU7s

Zoot Horn wrote:I like the RCA cleartops

I like them also, Robin PM me your addy and I'll drop a set of RCA 12AU7s in the mail to you. I picked up some VERY cheap.

ray

btw, I've become a fan of PSvane. the EARV20 is full of them
Magnaryder

Its going to be used equipment when I sell it, so it may as well be used equipment when I buy it.

Tim deParavicini's E.A.R. Yoshino V20 Integrated Amplifier, Fosgate Signature Phono pre, Lucas Labs 12B4/OD3 LineStage, No. 50 and 51 Carverfest Tube amps, Hammond M3 tube amp, Ariston RD-40 Turntable w/ Linn Basik LSV tonearn, Grado Statement Master1 cartridge, Carver TX-8 & 11 tuners, Carver TD-12, Tascam CC-222mkII CD recorder, DBX-3BX & 200xg & 120x, CarverAudio ALV prototypes, Alesis Studio One loudspeakers, Energy Reference 22 Connoisseur, Cambridge Audio Model 8s, The Carver Research DarkStar Sub and Stax Earspeakers.

THIS SPACE FOR RENT...helping the blind to hear, one valve at a time
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tinpan

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TFM-45

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Joined: Tue Jan 05, 2010 7:48 am

Location: Spotsylvania, VA

Post Thu Oct 09, 2014 2:59 pm

Re: Looking for suggestions for 12AU7s

Very cool Pm on the way. I like you sig line too.

Thanks

Tinpan
Tinpan

HT - Sunfire TG IV, Sunfire Cinema Grand Sig. 400 x 5, Oppo 93, Klipsch LaScala (3), Cornwalls (2), SW-12, Sony 60" LCD

2 channel - AN L2 Pre-amp, AN Interstage Mono Blocks 300b PSE, AN 2.1 DAC, DUAL CS 5000 TT, Oppo DV-981HD, Lowther PM4a/Azurahorn/SentryIV

2 channel - AN L3 Signature Line stage, AN Interstage Mono Blocks 300b PSE, AN Sig. DAC 3.1 , AN Sig. Phono Stage, Sota Comet TT, Altec A5's

2 channel - Carver VTA20 Baby Black Beauty, Custom Line Stage, Klipschorns

2 channel - AN Interstage Mono Blocks 300b PSE, Carver C-5 Pre, Altec A4 speakers


2 channel - Audio Note Kit 1 300b SET, Audio Note DAC 2.1, Altec 288 Horns/JBL Bass bin
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tinpan

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TFM-45

Posts: 583

Joined: Tue Jan 05, 2010 7:48 am

Location: Spotsylvania, VA

Post Fri Oct 10, 2014 7:10 am

Re: Looking for suggestions for 12AU7s

Well, the HP tube seemed to fall apart after about an hour listening. It seemed to do ok on a jazz album but when I put an album on with some vocals it really sounded badly.

Since this phono stage only uses a single 6DJ8 I think I'll get a couple of known good tubes for further experiments. In looking on TC tubes they have a couple listed as phono grade. I see an Orange Globe Amperex which looks reasonable, another Bugle Boy for $100 and a Telefunken for $189. What do you guys think about the Telefunken? I've read some folks like them and some don't.

Thanks

Tinpan
Tinpan

HT - Sunfire TG IV, Sunfire Cinema Grand Sig. 400 x 5, Oppo 93, Klipsch LaScala (3), Cornwalls (2), SW-12, Sony 60" LCD

2 channel - AN L2 Pre-amp, AN Interstage Mono Blocks 300b PSE, AN 2.1 DAC, DUAL CS 5000 TT, Oppo DV-981HD, Lowther PM4a/Azurahorn/SentryIV

2 channel - AN L3 Signature Line stage, AN Interstage Mono Blocks 300b PSE, AN Sig. DAC 3.1 , AN Sig. Phono Stage, Sota Comet TT, Altec A5's

2 channel - Carver VTA20 Baby Black Beauty, Custom Line Stage, Klipschorns

2 channel - AN Interstage Mono Blocks 300b PSE, Carver C-5 Pre, Altec A4 speakers


2 channel - Audio Note Kit 1 300b SET, Audio Note DAC 2.1, Altec 288 Horns/JBL Bass bin
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tinpan

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TFM-45

Posts: 583

Joined: Tue Jan 05, 2010 7:48 am

Location: Spotsylvania, VA

Post Tue Oct 21, 2014 3:34 pm

Re: Looking for suggestions for 12AU7s

Well it turns out it wasn't the tube falling apart, it was a different phono cartridge I was trying. Guess I better stick to one thing at a time.

So, here's where I'm at so far.

The Bendix 5852 that replaced the 6X5 is probably the baddest tube I have seen to date. This set up, my Lowther setup, has always been kicked back and kind of smooth and mellow. This system has the L2 Preamp and the 2.1 DAC where as the other system, Altec A5's. has the better L3, Dac 3.1 and phone stage, all signature versions. The Altec system has always been a notch above the Lowther system although none would ever tell me.

This Bendix tube elevates the whole system. I put one in the dac and the preamp, it takes about a minute to warm up. The sound is just there, the bass, the warm rich tones better detail. I am glad I got 6 of them.

Next up was the phono stage, it uses one 6DJ8 and one 12AX7. I am finding out these have to be critically clean sounding.

Originally I had a Westinghouse 6DJ8 that sounded very nice but had a little noise when you cranked it up a little and were changing records. Before you turn the volume back down. I tried a Bugle boy in there and it was really noisy, didn't sound good at all so it had to come out. Currently I have an Orange Globe Amperex in there and it sounds better but I;m not during I'm hearing the detail like I did before. I;m not sure what I had in there originally but it looks like I have some playing around still to do.

The 12AX7 that I pulled was a GE JAN12AX7WA and i am finding out I really like that tube a lot. Currently I have a Telefunken 12AX7 in there, not sure it has the detail the GE tube has. One thing I am finding out is I need really clean tubes for this section

The line stage had a pair of Philips JAN5814A and I replaced them with the RCA Clear tops, they seem a little warmer but I'm not sure they are as detailed.

I need to spend some time listening trying different combinations. Sometimes it seems like you take a step back before you can go forward again.

The other tube I rolled was in my DAC 2.1 it has an ECL82, the 6X5 , both in the power supply. I had a pair of cheap EH 6922's in there as well and tried the Bugle boys I pulled from the L2. Didn't like the sound at all. They were noisy and you could hear a cycle in them. They came out and the cheap EH's went back in for now.
Tinpan

HT - Sunfire TG IV, Sunfire Cinema Grand Sig. 400 x 5, Oppo 93, Klipsch LaScala (3), Cornwalls (2), SW-12, Sony 60" LCD

2 channel - AN L2 Pre-amp, AN Interstage Mono Blocks 300b PSE, AN 2.1 DAC, DUAL CS 5000 TT, Oppo DV-981HD, Lowther PM4a/Azurahorn/SentryIV

2 channel - AN L3 Signature Line stage, AN Interstage Mono Blocks 300b PSE, AN Sig. DAC 3.1 , AN Sig. Phono Stage, Sota Comet TT, Altec A5's

2 channel - Carver VTA20 Baby Black Beauty, Custom Line Stage, Klipschorns

2 channel - AN Interstage Mono Blocks 300b PSE, Carver C-5 Pre, Altec A4 speakers


2 channel - Audio Note Kit 1 300b SET, Audio Note DAC 2.1, Altec 288 Horns/JBL Bass bin
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helicopterpilotdoug

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Location: Austin TX

Post Wed Oct 22, 2014 7:28 am

Re: Looking for suggestions for 12AU7s

tinpan wrote:Next up was the phono stage, it uses one 6DJ8 and one 12AX7. I am finding out these have to be critically clean sounding.

Originally I had a Westinghouse 6DJ8 that sounded very nice but had a little noise when you cranked it up a little and were changing records. Before you turn the volume back down. I tried a Bugle boy in there and it was really noisy, didn't sound good at all so it had to come out. Currently I have an Orange Globe Amperex in there and it sounds better but I;m not during I'm hearing the detail like I did before. I;m not sure what I had in there originally but it looks like I have some playing around still to do.

In the 6DJ8 slot, Try the Telefunken E88CC/6922. I bought a pair of them for the Sunfire Tube pre and nothing I've rolled in there sounds as good. I bought them from Upscale Audio, and have been very pleased with their performance. These tubes are NOS made in the 1966 to 1968 era. I got them cryogenically treated, and they are a matched pair. I need to get another one to go in the V1 contour slot.
Sunfire: Theater Grand IV, Cinema Grand Signature.
Carver: TFM-45, PST-24 Cassette, Extra Carver Gear: CT-6, C-11 (S/N 00001).
Polk Audio: Mains SRS 2.1TL, Center CSiA6, Surrounds FXiA6 and FXiA4, Sub DSW MicroPro 1000, Extra Speakers SDA 2A, SDA 2Btl, Monitor 10A.
Turntable: Dual CS 714Q
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CD: Sony 330 300 Disk changer

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