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AL-III.....Owners...

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stevewithrow

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Post Mon Dec 01, 2008 2:16 pm

AL-III.....Owners...

Ok , heres the deal..I pulled this out of my manual...So what is it...4 or 8 ohms....alone what is the ribbon...?..4 ohms...?...I love these speakers , but it seams I have been battling with these ever since I bought em... I just recently got an TFM , I bi amped them..I put the 35 on the ribbons....so I figure im pushing around 400 watts at 4 ohms into those...doesnt sound like 400 watts...I have put a parasound HCA 1000 on the woofers...ugly...put an NAD 2400 ( 200 watts at 4 ohms )..ugly....the woofers buzz and make gross sounds...maybe cuz they produce sounds 150 hz and below....I have replace the woofers with JBL,s..they are rated at 4 ohms...to be honest I feel like I am chasing a ghost...I did just hook up the 35 by itself and it sounded ok , but im afraid of pushing the amp...Im thinking cuz the ribbons require so much power that they wont sound like other speaker with the same power...for instance , somew polks with the TFM 35 would blow away the AL-III,s...dont get me wrong , I love my AL-III,s...maybe some advice from owners that have this same problem...

so what is it 4 or 8 ohms...


Impedance Nominal 4 ohms


Recommended Power: Up to 575 watts
per channel; 65 watts minimum, 8 ohm
rated.
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TNRabbit

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Post Mon Dec 01, 2008 2:32 pm

Re: AL-III.....Owners...

4 ohms total, nominal.

@ 3.8 ohm per ribbon direct; 4 ohms per woofer. (you can check with a multimeter)

I'm confused by the lower than 150 hz comment. Did you bypass the internal crossover or are you running speaker wire to the connectors on the back?? I think the buzzing you heard with only 200 wpc was the amp....but I'd have to hear them to tell you for sure. Where exactly in PA are you?

Something isn't right. That said, My Klipsch will absolutely blow the AL-IIIs out of the water, SPL-wise. I'm running 800 wpc from my Sunfire into EACH ribbon and EACH woofer. I can blow fuses if I push it, but it gives me the headroom I need to push some reference-level sound.
TNRabbit
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stevewithrow

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Post Mon Dec 01, 2008 2:38 pm

Re: AL-III.....Owners...

TNRabbit wrote:4 ohms total, nominal.

@ 3.8 ohm per ribbon direct; 4 ohms per woofer. (you can check with a multimeter)

I'm confused by the lower than 150 hz comment. Did you bypass the internal crossover or are you running speaker wire to the connectors on the back?? I think the buzzing you heard with only 200 wpc was the amp....but I'd have to hear them to tell you for sure. Where exactly in PA are you?

Something isn't right. That said, My Klipsch will absolutely blow the AL-IIIs out of the water, SPL-wise. I'm running 800 wpc from my Sunfire into EACH ribbon and EACH woofer. I can blow fuses if I push it, but it gives me the headroom I need to push some reference-level sound.

Hi Gary , im in Tacoma...the Manual states the ribbons carry all requancys above 150 and the woofer below 150 , I would like to see the # at 80 and below , but the ribbons would not handle 80 and above....im really confused here...im pushing 800 to each speaker...doesnt sound like it...I did not surpase the internal X-overs , all I did is take off the connectors to the 4 post..
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BillD

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Post Mon Dec 01, 2008 4:24 pm

Re: AL-III.....Owners...

Well, you have a pair of woofers, so 150Hz isn't a bad number. I have some 12" AR3a woofers that handle anything from 575Hz down when they are coupled with the midrange and tweeter. You really only need to go down to 80Hz if you want ONE woofer (i.e., a subwoofer). They say that that is the frequency where sound becomes omnidirectional.

Don't understand the issue you're having unless it just isn't enough power. I do like Rabbit does. 800 watts on each ribbon and on each woofer.
It should sound like it isn't there!
There is a difference between hearing and listening...
Making life enjoyable through expensive electronics.
_________________
Carver: C-4000 & C-1 preamps, PSC-60 preamp/tuner, TX-11a tuner, M-400 (2), C-500, M-500, M-500t, M-500t Mk.II, A-500x, AL-III loudspeakers (2 pr.)
Sunfire:Theater Grand III processor, Ultimate Receiver, Cinema Grand Signature 400 ~ seven, True Subwoofer Mk. II, D-10 Subwoofer
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stevewithrow

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Post Mon Dec 01, 2008 5:21 pm

Re: AL-III.....Owners...

BillD wrote:Well, you have a pair of woofers, so 150Hz isn't a bad number. I have some 12" AR3a woofers that handle anything from 575Hz down when they are coupled with the midrange and tweeter. You really only need to go down to 80Hz if you want ONE woofer (i.e., a subwoofer). They say that that is the frequency where sound becomes omnidirectional.

Don't understand the issue you're having unless it just isn't enough power. I do like Rabbit does. 800 watts on each ribbon and on each woofer.

Well its come down to this..I think it might be the woofers I replaced them with..I took out the cross overs off the back , took out the insulation , and the noise looks like its coming from the woofer...now I replaced the old ones with JBL,s..they where made for car audio...I wounder if that could be the problem...im going to put back the origanals....

update...the original back in and the certain noise at a certain hz was gone....geeze...
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Reese

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Post Mon Dec 01, 2008 5:37 pm

Re: AL-III.....Owners...

Maybe those JBLs just thought they were in a low-rider boombox trunk arrangement and had to rattle something -- like the license plate on the rear bumper!

j/k -- I hope your problems are solved!

Reese
Too often we enjoy the comfort of opinion without the discomfort of thought -- JFK

Sunfire Classic Tube Preamp; 2 Carver Silver 7ts, 2 Silver 9ts; bi-amped ALS (Originals upgraded to Platinum), Rane PE15's eq's and Rane AC22 xcrossover; Carver c-19 tube pre;
Carver 390t CD carousel; Carver 490t CD player; BBE 362 Sonic Maximizer; C-9 SH; Sony ES tuner and DAT deck; Sony CD copier/burner; Sony dual cassette deck; TEAC 2340R 4 ch r to r tape deck; Dual CS5000 tt, Shure V15 Type V-MR cartridge
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stevewithrow

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Post Mon Dec 01, 2008 5:46 pm

Re: AL-III.....Owners...

Reese wrote:Maybe those JBLs just thought they were in a low-rider boombox trunk arrangement and had to rattle something -- like the license plate on the rear bumper!

j/k -- I hope your problems are solved!

Reese

That was tottaly mean....... :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
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docadillac

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Post Thu Dec 04, 2008 1:58 pm

Re: AL-III.....Owners...

I once had a problem with a woofer that was just rebuilt. It seems the voice coil was rubbing a little and would buzz more noticeably at some times than others. It was under warranty so it was all good. Glad the problem is gone Steve.
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jvds

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Post Thu Dec 11, 2008 4:53 pm

Re: AL-III.....Owners...

Hi, I posted here a couple of years ago concerning the subs. I replaced them with a car audio sub with very similar specs only had to redo the port. I even had the crossover components upgraded which worked great on the ribbons and not on the subs so I undid the sub part. a couple of hundred down the tubes! I am toying with reinstalling the oem woofers. I do believe mr carver knew what he was doing. the cabinet leaves a bit to be desired. I plan on sealing it better, stiffening it, coating the interior with a anti-vibration coating and adding wieght to the woofer cabinet.
I now have quads in my main system and the carvers are in a back room with a MC402 amp. sound ok. Orig I had a NAD 402 to the subs and a tfm 35 to the ribbons. lots of power really lit it up. Here is something interesting, I have ART Audio concerto Mono tube amps pushing about 60-70 wpc and I put them on the al IIIs and lit them up. I mean loud!

The quads sound better for sure, but cannot match the carver's spl. I have compared the carvers to lots of stuff in the 15 years I've had them and rarely would i spend the money to replace them.

The Quads however are to me in a class by themselves especially with the tube amps.

I have schematics for the al III crossovers and you can download the original stereophile review from 92 somewhere.

good luck

jvds
i believe
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stevewithrow

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Post Thu Dec 11, 2008 7:38 pm

Re: AL-III.....Owners...

Thats good stuff,,,one thing I also did different is that I have 4 sub outs on my STG II...I ran 2 of em to my NAD 2400 and then to the AL-III,s subs.....I have the TFM 35 to the ribbons...From the STG I ran the speakers in small mode and crossed at 125 HZ from the STG....I tell you what , those AL-III,s will blow you off the couch....Im not kidding ya ,,I also have a Paradigm PW-2400 sub....Heck I dont even need it...I turned it down....even with out it , the bass from the AL-III,s ran this way , well , you can fell it your chest now....I just sit there in awe.... 8)
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BillD

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Post Thu Dec 11, 2008 8:59 pm

Re: AL-III.....Owners...

So, you're running your Theater Grand as an active crossover. The only problem I see is that you may be missing 25Hz of upper bass unless you took the AL-III crossovers out. THe crossover point of AL-IIIs is 150Hz, so between 125Hz and there, you have only the rolloff going for you.
It should sound like it isn't there!
There is a difference between hearing and listening...
Making life enjoyable through expensive electronics.
_________________
Carver: C-4000 & C-1 preamps, PSC-60 preamp/tuner, TX-11a tuner, M-400 (2), C-500, M-500, M-500t, M-500t Mk.II, A-500x, AL-III loudspeakers (2 pr.)
Sunfire:Theater Grand III processor, Ultimate Receiver, Cinema Grand Signature 400 ~ seven, True Subwoofer Mk. II, D-10 Subwoofer
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stevewithrow

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Post Thu Dec 11, 2008 10:24 pm

Re: AL-III.....Owners...

BillD wrote:So, you're running your Theater Grand as an active crossover. The only problem I see is that you may be missing 25Hz of upper bass unless you took the AL-III crossovers out. THe crossover point of AL-IIIs is 150Hz, so between 125Hz and there, you have only the rolloff going for you.

Yes you are right....but to be honest I cannot hear the differance...So what I did on the STG is set the speakers on small...the manual doesnt say , but does mention the frequency is rolled alittle higher , and lower hz is rolled to the sub...then I set the X-over in the STG at 125 HZ....All i can say is that I have had these speakers for 6 months...And these sound like incridible set like this....as you know the woofer on the AL-III,s have always lacked....even my girl friend noticed a HUGE differnace.....thats saying alot...so yes the STG can effect around 150 hz down to 80 hz...I wish I could bring this set up to Carver fest...
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BillD

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Post Fri Dec 12, 2008 3:02 pm

Re: AL-III.....Owners...

I have the III, and mine can go past 150Hz. I'd up that crossover point to 150Hz to get the most out of your speaks (on small). That way, the ribbons will be getting 150Hz and up, and the woofs will be getting 150Hz down. That is a great idea for those with a Sunfire Theater Grand. You can use the adjustments on your real subs to block content above the desired frequency (say 80Hz) Gary — are you paying attention here? You don't need a Rane!
It should sound like it isn't there!
There is a difference between hearing and listening...
Making life enjoyable through expensive electronics.
_________________
Carver: C-4000 & C-1 preamps, PSC-60 preamp/tuner, TX-11a tuner, M-400 (2), C-500, M-500, M-500t, M-500t Mk.II, A-500x, AL-III loudspeakers (2 pr.)
Sunfire:Theater Grand III processor, Ultimate Receiver, Cinema Grand Signature 400 ~ seven, True Subwoofer Mk. II, D-10 Subwoofer
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stevewithrow

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Location: Great NorthWest.....Carver Country..

Post Fri Dec 12, 2008 3:48 pm

Re: AL-III.....Owners...

BillD wrote:I have the III, and mine can go past 150Hz. I'd up that crossover point to 150Hz to get the most out of your speaks (on small). That way, the ribbons will be getting 150Hz and up, and the woofs will be getting 150Hz down. That is a great idea for those with a Sunfire Theater Grand. You can use the adjustments on your real subs to block content above the desired frequency (say 80Hz) Gary — are you paying attention here? You don't need a Rane!

My STG II only goes up to 125 hz , but by using the pre,s small speaker output , I get close to the 150 hz range..then run the sub outs to the woofers....it was like the AL-III,s stood up 10 feet tall...
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BillD

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Post Fri Dec 12, 2008 4:33 pm

Re: AL-III.....Owners...

You probably aren't getting much stereo separation in the bass region 8)
It should sound like it isn't there!
There is a difference between hearing and listening...
Making life enjoyable through expensive electronics.
_________________
Carver: C-4000 & C-1 preamps, PSC-60 preamp/tuner, TX-11a tuner, M-400 (2), C-500, M-500, M-500t, M-500t Mk.II, A-500x, AL-III loudspeakers (2 pr.)
Sunfire:Theater Grand III processor, Ultimate Receiver, Cinema Grand Signature 400 ~ seven, True Subwoofer Mk. II, D-10 Subwoofer
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