FAQ  •  Register   •  Gallery •  Login

It is currently Tue Oct 21, 2014 8:36 am

Help troubleshooting CF amps.....

<<

TNRabbit

User avatar

(pair of) SILVER-7 TUBE AMPs

Posts: 13335

Joined: Sun Jan 14, 2007 11:53 am

Location: TN Native Languishing in VA

Post Tue Jan 24, 2012 12:01 am

Help troubleshooting CF amps.....

....I'll get pics up in the next couple of days, but I have 3 of the 4 amps done & have different issues with each:

1. Built at CF, Bob certified it, sounded good when I left. I added a couple of circuits that Alex said I left out & now has hardly any output which is GREATLY distorted.

2. Built at home; sounds pretty good, but have massive buzz (ground loop)....tried removing the neutral leg but no joy....

3. Tried to plug in the input & got a spark; have a few DC volts on the GROUND of this circuit! WTF???

Ideas?
TNRabbit
Image

From FrankieD's lips to your ears: Sunfire - a quiet box of endless power.

Sunfire TG-IV/400~7 Amp
Carver SD/A-360 CDP
Benchmark DAC-1
Sony SACD/DVD-A
Active bi-amp: Ashly XR-1001 & 2 Rane PEQ-15s
Main: HotRodded AL-IIIs
Sub: Klipsch RT-12d
Center: Sunfire CRS-3c
Surround: Sunfire CRS-3 (x 2)

OconeeOrange wrote:"Gary likes to play it 'loud' as do I. His system begs you turn it up until you die"

RIP WIlliam B. Dibble, 1948-2012. I'll miss you my friend.
<<

mbskeam

User avatar

SILVER-7t

Posts: 1984

Joined: Mon Jan 25, 2010 2:32 am

Location: Woodinville Wa

Post Tue Jan 24, 2012 12:15 am

Re: Help troubleshooting CF amps.....

parts in the wrong place???
Mbskeam


#1 BLACK BEAUTY's made by the man, the myth, the legend Bob Carver
CARVER: TFM-75, TFM-45(3), SD/A-490T
SUNFIRE: Tube pre
2 sets of ALS'3, set of SILVERS, set of PLATS
AUDIOCONTROL: phase coupled activator
KENWOOD: BASIC M2a (2)

“Youth ages, immaturity is outgrown, ignorance can be educated, and drunkenness sobered, but stupid lasts forever.”
― Aristophanes

The only thing I'll feel......will be the RECOIL
Necronomicon Ex-Mortis....... Klaatu Barada Nikkto
"We should seek the greatest value of our action"
<<

TNRabbit

User avatar

(pair of) SILVER-7 TUBE AMPs

Posts: 13335

Joined: Sun Jan 14, 2007 11:53 am

Location: TN Native Languishing in VA

Post Tue Jan 24, 2012 12:26 am

Re: Help troubleshooting CF amps.....

mbskeam wrote:parts in the wrong place???



It was my understanding that resistors don't have to be put in a particular direction....?
TNRabbit
Image

From FrankieD's lips to your ears: Sunfire - a quiet box of endless power.

Sunfire TG-IV/400~7 Amp
Carver SD/A-360 CDP
Benchmark DAC-1
Sony SACD/DVD-A
Active bi-amp: Ashly XR-1001 & 2 Rane PEQ-15s
Main: HotRodded AL-IIIs
Sub: Klipsch RT-12d
Center: Sunfire CRS-3c
Surround: Sunfire CRS-3 (x 2)

OconeeOrange wrote:"Gary likes to play it 'loud' as do I. His system begs you turn it up until you die"

RIP WIlliam B. Dibble, 1948-2012. I'll miss you my friend.
<<

treitz3

User avatar

"Julian"
"Julian"

Posts: 7746

Joined: Mon Oct 16, 2006 5:39 pm

Location: The tube lair in Charlotte, NC

Post Tue Jan 24, 2012 12:29 am

Yes, resistors are uni-directional. Not that that helps with the troubleshooting at all.
In search of accurate reproduction of music. Real sound is my reference and while perfection may not be attainable? If I chase it, I might just catch excellence.

The best way to enjoy digital music reproduction is to never listen to a good analogue reproduction.

Robert R. - "Did you see my North Korea analogy? I should have named it Carversite.kim"
<<

angelod307

SILVER-7 TUBE AMP

Posts: 2724

Joined: Sat Jun 06, 2009 10:56 pm

Location: manning, sc

Post Tue Jan 24, 2012 12:44 am

Re: Help troubleshooting CF amps.....

:(
CarverFest: I just go for the arts and crafts
<<

mbskeam

User avatar

SILVER-7t

Posts: 1984

Joined: Mon Jan 25, 2010 2:32 am

Location: Woodinville Wa

Post Tue Jan 24, 2012 12:51 am

Re: Help troubleshooting CF amps.....

I'm being serious.
I think ya have something in the wrong place
there are 47ohm 470ohm and 47kohm resistors, do you have them in all the correct places?
do you have the small caps in the right place, the 100pf and the .0047uf?

as to the dc on the input, do you have a glob of solder bridging or touching some place it should not be....
bad rca input?

not sure about the hum, if you swap the PS transformer it may go away.
Mbskeam


#1 BLACK BEAUTY's made by the man, the myth, the legend Bob Carver
CARVER: TFM-75, TFM-45(3), SD/A-490T
SUNFIRE: Tube pre
2 sets of ALS'3, set of SILVERS, set of PLATS
AUDIOCONTROL: phase coupled activator
KENWOOD: BASIC M2a (2)

“Youth ages, immaturity is outgrown, ignorance can be educated, and drunkenness sobered, but stupid lasts forever.”
― Aristophanes

The only thing I'll feel......will be the RECOIL
Necronomicon Ex-Mortis....... Klaatu Barada Nikkto
"We should seek the greatest value of our action"
<<

TNRabbit

User avatar

(pair of) SILVER-7 TUBE AMPs

Posts: 13335

Joined: Sun Jan 14, 2007 11:53 am

Location: TN Native Languishing in VA

Post Tue Jan 24, 2012 1:18 am

Re: Help troubleshooting CF amps.....

I know; I've looked at all the amps & they are the same except a few resistors in opposite direction.

By swap the PS, you mean the leads or the entire PS?

I'm wondering if there's an issue with the cheap-ass RCAs I used on the stainless chassis amps......
TNRabbit
Image

From FrankieD's lips to your ears: Sunfire - a quiet box of endless power.

Sunfire TG-IV/400~7 Amp
Carver SD/A-360 CDP
Benchmark DAC-1
Sony SACD/DVD-A
Active bi-amp: Ashly XR-1001 & 2 Rane PEQ-15s
Main: HotRodded AL-IIIs
Sub: Klipsch RT-12d
Center: Sunfire CRS-3c
Surround: Sunfire CRS-3 (x 2)

OconeeOrange wrote:"Gary likes to play it 'loud' as do I. His system begs you turn it up until you die"

RIP WIlliam B. Dibble, 1948-2012. I'll miss you my friend.
<<

Martin1970

User avatar

TFM-25

Posts: 356

Joined: Sat Mar 06, 2010 5:44 pm

Location: Savannah, GA

Post Tue Jan 24, 2012 9:04 am

Re: Help troubleshooting CF amps.....

TNRabbit wrote:I'm wondering if there's an issue with the cheap-ass RCAs I used on the stainless chassis amps......


Not that this matters to your issue, but my RCAs stripped and it loves to cut up until I retighten them to that 'magic spot' where they grip just enough. Been looking for better replacements, but the ones at PE look like they're the same ones.

How about linking to some comprehensive pics of your troublesome amp.
You know, another set of eyes and all that...
Carver: ALS plat upgrades, TX-11a, C-9, C-1
Sunfire: Cinema Grand Sig 400 Seven x2
Rane: RPM88 26Z x3
<<

TNRabbit

User avatar

(pair of) SILVER-7 TUBE AMPs

Posts: 13335

Joined: Sun Jan 14, 2007 11:53 am

Location: TN Native Languishing in VA

Post Tue Jan 24, 2012 10:01 am

Re: Help troubleshooting CF amps.....

Martin1970 wrote:How about linking to some comprehensive pics of your troublesome amp.
You know, another set of eyes and all that...


TNRabbit wrote:....I'll get pics up in the next couple of days, but I have 3 of the 4 amps done & have different issues with each:

1. Built at CF, Bob certified it, sounded good when I left. I added a couple of circuits that Alex said I left out & now has hardly any output which is GREATLY distorted.

2. Built at home; sounds pretty good, but have massive buzz (ground loop)....tried removing the neutral leg but no joy....

3. Tried to plug in the input & got a spark; have a few DC volts on the GROUND of this circuit! WTF???

Ideas?
TNRabbit
Image

From FrankieD's lips to your ears: Sunfire - a quiet box of endless power.

Sunfire TG-IV/400~7 Amp
Carver SD/A-360 CDP
Benchmark DAC-1
Sony SACD/DVD-A
Active bi-amp: Ashly XR-1001 & 2 Rane PEQ-15s
Main: HotRodded AL-IIIs
Sub: Klipsch RT-12d
Center: Sunfire CRS-3c
Surround: Sunfire CRS-3 (x 2)

OconeeOrange wrote:"Gary likes to play it 'loud' as do I. His system begs you turn it up until you die"

RIP WIlliam B. Dibble, 1948-2012. I'll miss you my friend.
<<

TNRabbit

User avatar

(pair of) SILVER-7 TUBE AMPs

Posts: 13335

Joined: Sun Jan 14, 2007 11:53 am

Location: TN Native Languishing in VA

Post Tue Jan 24, 2012 11:15 am

Re: Help troubleshooting CF amps.....

OK, had some time, so here are pics:

Amp 1:

Image
Image
Image
Image
Image
Image
Image
Image
Image
Image
Image
Image
Image
Image
Image
Image
Image
Image
Image


Amp 2:

Image
Image
Image
Image
Image
Image
Image
Image
Image
Image
Image
Image
Image
Image
Image
Image
Image
Image
Image
Image
Image
Image


Amp 3:

Image
Image
Image
Image
Image
Image
Image
Image
Image
Image
Image
Image
Image
Image
Image
Image
TNRabbit
Image

From FrankieD's lips to your ears: Sunfire - a quiet box of endless power.

Sunfire TG-IV/400~7 Amp
Carver SD/A-360 CDP
Benchmark DAC-1
Sony SACD/DVD-A
Active bi-amp: Ashly XR-1001 & 2 Rane PEQ-15s
Main: HotRodded AL-IIIs
Sub: Klipsch RT-12d
Center: Sunfire CRS-3c
Surround: Sunfire CRS-3 (x 2)

OconeeOrange wrote:"Gary likes to play it 'loud' as do I. His system begs you turn it up until you die"

RIP WIlliam B. Dibble, 1948-2012. I'll miss you my friend.
<<

engtaz

User avatar

"TAZ"

Posts: 5223

Joined: Sat Jun 30, 2007 1:43 pm

Location: Tampa, FL

Post Tue Jan 24, 2012 11:56 am

Re: Help troubleshooting CF amps.....

SSS WWW EEE EEE TTT job Gary. Im jealous because I have not even started my last 2. :x
engtaz


Carver M4.0T in front channels to Caver AL VI's in SACD & 2 Channel setup
C 16, PT 2400, Slim Device, Carver TX-8, 490T and Rega TT w Grado Gold cart in the 2 channel setup
Bogen SRB20 is computer amp
Carver PM-350 donated for youth church use
<<

elgrau

SILVER-7 TUBE AMP

Posts: 2892

Joined: Wed May 31, 2006 9:33 pm

Post Tue Jan 24, 2012 12:25 pm

Re: Help troubleshooting CF amps.....

"Oh what a tangled web we weave...."

I think I'd send one off to Rita/Rolland and then meticuloiusly check to make sure that the other two(?) are wired exactly like this one that he/she sends back that now works. Check every terminal strip/tube socket/juncture and verify that the parts eminating from each is the same (as the working amp). Being unemployed you should have the time for this.... :D
Family room: 400 disk changer with PS Audio Digital Link III DAC; Technics SL-1100A TT. QED Quenx1 IC's from DAC & TT to Adcom GTP-602 preamp/Tuner. AudioQuest King Cobra IC's from preamp to M1.0t mk-II opt2. QED Silver Spirals 4M wires to EPI 1000’s.
Living room: AudioQuest Black Mamba 8M IC's from family room preamp to Barcus-Berry 2002R Sonic Maximizer to GlowPower Zyxt IC's to Sunfire 300x2 to Nordost 6M bi-source wires to AOS 28" MDF spherical speakers using six 8" woofers and eight 1" dome tweeters symm. arranged around the surface.
SS system: CX-995V DVD to AV-705x 5 channel amp (center/rears) & M1.0t mk-II opt2(fronts).
Garage: TLM-3600 CDP to MXR150 Receiver (pre) to TFM-42 to EPI 400 speakers.
<<

hewlew1

"You Fuckin' Fucks"

Posts: 1281

Joined: Tue Feb 17, 2004 11:02 pm

Location: Northeast, Pa

Post Tue Jan 24, 2012 12:42 pm

Re: Help troubleshooting CF amps.....

Gary, I think I see in the various photos some cold solder joints as well as some joints that are not what you would call mechanically solid( wires not wrapped and squeezed with needle nose pliers around the terminal strip lugs).I would spend a little time touching up the solder joints this may help.Good luck, Harry
"Carver Audio, why settle for less, just ask my neighbors"
C1,C2,CT3,CT6,CT7/3,CT23,CT26,C4000,The Receiver,M500,M500T/6,M1.5T,TFM24/2,TFM/25/3,TFM35,TFM35X,TFM42/2,DTL200,TDR1700,DPL20,TX11/2, 5.2Center,5.1Sub/3,Original Amazings,Platinum Amazings/2,AL3'S,Polk SDA SRS, Polk SDA 1C's, Polk RTA11's, Polk Monitor 10's/2 ,Monitor 7's, Sunfire 300x2 /5, Sunfire pre, Sunfire MK2 Sub/2, 4 Carverfest monoblocks, Carverfest linestage preamp/2, Mapletree Audio Designs Tube Preamp,Phase Linear Andromeda III speakers, Phase Linear 4000 Preamp, Dahlquist DQ-10's
CERTIFIED AMPLE PLIERS EXPERT
Some of the best fuckings we get during our lifetime come from a relative!
I don't kiss ass, I dont take peoples shit, so dont expect it from me!
<<

hewlew1

"You Fuckin' Fucks"

Posts: 1281

Joined: Tue Feb 17, 2004 11:02 pm

Location: Northeast, Pa

Post Tue Jan 24, 2012 1:04 pm

Re: Help troubleshooting CF amps.....

Gary, I have another suggestion . I can see you are building these as monoblocks but for the purpose of troubleshooting I would remove the jumper wire between the 2 red speaker terminals and hook up 2 speakers to each amp. You may indeed have one channel that is working correctly but bridged together you cant tell this. If this is the case it is much easier to troubleshoot the one channel that has a problem. Harry
"Carver Audio, why settle for less, just ask my neighbors"
C1,C2,CT3,CT6,CT7/3,CT23,CT26,C4000,The Receiver,M500,M500T/6,M1.5T,TFM24/2,TFM/25/3,TFM35,TFM35X,TFM42/2,DTL200,TDR1700,DPL20,TX11/2, 5.2Center,5.1Sub/3,Original Amazings,Platinum Amazings/2,AL3'S,Polk SDA SRS, Polk SDA 1C's, Polk RTA11's, Polk Monitor 10's/2 ,Monitor 7's, Sunfire 300x2 /5, Sunfire pre, Sunfire MK2 Sub/2, 4 Carverfest monoblocks, Carverfest linestage preamp/2, Mapletree Audio Designs Tube Preamp,Phase Linear Andromeda III speakers, Phase Linear 4000 Preamp, Dahlquist DQ-10's
CERTIFIED AMPLE PLIERS EXPERT
Some of the best fuckings we get during our lifetime come from a relative!
I don't kiss ass, I dont take peoples shit, so dont expect it from me!
<<

mbskeam

User avatar

SILVER-7t

Posts: 1984

Joined: Mon Jan 25, 2010 2:32 am

Location: Woodinville Wa

Post Tue Jan 24, 2012 10:59 pm

Re: Help troubleshooting CF amps.....

Image

this area is the problem ....
need a better pic, push the wire out of the way and try and bend all the parts, so that they do not overlap in the pic to get a better view.
does that tag strip have parts soldered to the ground lug on the end???

you have 5 of lugs used, on mine I have 4 used. no parts should go to on this ground on this strip, except the ground going back to the main ground point, over at the PS area

amp 3 looks the same.... on this tag strip


Image

this 47 ohm res goes back to here

???? the cap that is circled is this the smaller of the 2 (100pf)
Mbskeam


#1 BLACK BEAUTY's made by the man, the myth, the legend Bob Carver
CARVER: TFM-75, TFM-45(3), SD/A-490T
SUNFIRE: Tube pre
2 sets of ALS'3, set of SILVERS, set of PLATS
AUDIOCONTROL: phase coupled activator
KENWOOD: BASIC M2a (2)

“Youth ages, immaturity is outgrown, ignorance can be educated, and drunkenness sobered, but stupid lasts forever.”
― Aristophanes

The only thing I'll feel......will be the RECOIL
Necronomicon Ex-Mortis....... Klaatu Barada Nikkto
"We should seek the greatest value of our action"
Next

Return to CarverFest 20w Tube Amp

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest

Powered by phpBB © 2011 phpBB Group.