DIY power cords and speaker wire

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basspig
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Re: DIY power cords and speaker wire

Post by basspig » Wed Oct 13, 2010 1:12 am

F1nut wrote:Once again, WHAT POWER CORDS HAVE YOU TRIED? Oh that's right, NONE, ZIP, ZERO, NADA!!! Do yourself and us a huge favor and shut the fuck up. In fact, why don't you jump off that cliff, you ignorant pig.

Wow, you must have special status here, to be able to get away with hurling ad hominem epithets at people who don't share your particular neurosis. Do yourself a favor and calm down before your blood pressure goes off the scale.
You should go join Michael Fremer.. you two would be great buddies together. Keepin' them snake oil power cord makers in business..
Next, I suppose you'll claim that your electric utility company changed a pole pig down the road and that messed up the 'smoothness' of your audio. Oh no wait.. your neighbor painted his house a different color, and that's upset the balance of your audio 'uhmmmmm'.
Oh well. An audiophool and his money are soon parted. Enjoy your overpriced power cords! [-X
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Re: DIY power cords and speaker wire

Post by F1nut » Wed Oct 13, 2010 1:21 am

I took a look at what you call an audio system. I've never seen anything quite like it and hope I never do again.

Oink oink :-"
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Re: DIY power cords and speaker wire

Post by Magnaryder » Thu Oct 14, 2010 12:40 pm

I'll weigh in with what little I've bothered to observe in my system. Keep in mind this applies to my system and my system only. I did not post this to argue. Please be kind and remember this as you read on.

During CF10 we noticed a 'snap' in the ribbons in the ALS speakers James built for Roy. Eventually we ran it down, my Lightstar was plugged into a powerline conditioner that was in fact the bottleneck. Once the amp was plugged into the wall all was fine. Lightstars massive bass extention returned and the delicate nuances in the music were again rendered. 'I' believe there can be a case made that a given cord might have an effect on reproduction. We heard it compress music and creat some nasty artifacts, that wasn't there after the conditioner was removed.

I realize what we heard was not a power cord issue but the example might be used to understand how a limp-dick cord might effect the music. I have since re-created that sound here in Ohio using a frightfully small powercord. I managed to get that same ribbon 'snap' when I pushed my amp. I have tried several 'better' powercords and the only thing I have heard is some better resolution of background detail and a slight broadening of the soundstage. But this was just using a huge gauge PC and the comparison was made using the limp-dick PC.

Another thing I've been considering recently..... We all know our speaker/amplifier interface suffers inductive reactance....will the power cord/power supply/electrical grid suffer something akin to that?

ray
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Re: DIY power cords and speaker wire

Post by Don » Thu Oct 14, 2010 2:33 pm

An earlier quote pretty much sums things up in my opinion:



If you hear a difference then buy the PC. If you don't hear a difference then don't buy it. 8) 8)

I believe it is best to let this thread die. [-o< [-o< Obviously, there are very strong opinions on both sides of the issue. ](*,) ](*,)

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Re: DIY power cords and speaker wire

Post by Magnaryder » Thu Oct 14, 2010 3:12 pm

Don wrote:An earlier quote pretty much sums things up in my opinion:



If you hear a difference then buy the PC. If you don't hear a difference then don't buy it. 8) 8)

I believe it is best to let this thread die. [-o< [-o< Obviously, there are very strong opinions on both sides of the issue. ](*,) ](*,)
Funny, as polarized as our hobby is everyone gets along when we get together. Each is intitled to his or her opinion and each idea is on display for you to examine at your leasure. I talked to James yesterday and explained how different my system sounds since I got it set up here at home. The overall tonal balace is much better, but the soundfield has collapsed. Imaging/depth/breadth are all but non-existant. I obviously fu(ked something up, but I have no idea what it might be.

any and all ideas or hints will be greatly appreciated

thanx

ray
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Re: DIY power cords and speaker wire

Post by elgrau » Thu Oct 14, 2010 4:59 pm

Very hard to say exactly why, Ray. I tend to put a lot on how well our ears/brains happen to be working at any given time. Have not had this experience since I started doing the Nerve Complex from healthline.cc, but used to remember "flat days" when virtually nothing sounded good/right. Then the next day everything would be sweetness and light and heavenly detailed and clear. Since I'd upgraded nothing, had to suspect my ears/brain. That's ONE reason that the "if you hear a difference (with PC, e.g.), then buy, if not, don't buy." thinking is flawed. Too many factors involved (song selection re recording quality, frequency content of a given song (which may or may not favor your ear's/system "response curve", etc.). But "mood" plays a big part. You'd need to live with a tweak/PC for a while to fully assess its impact on YOUR (total) music "system". That's one reason I like to focus on the upgrades that I understand and therefore I'm willing to commit the time and $'s to implementing that upgrade because I'm confident that it will "bear fruit". If I had unlimited $'s and TIME, I might be more "adventerous" and just try them all and see what "sticks"; but I don't. I like to just listen to the music.....and thank God that I "found" what upgradess I DO have. To each his own. That said, one "acid test" that beats them all (re "tweaks") IMHO that us old farts (who tend to listen periodically to the same songs for many, many years and only gradually add new stuff) can use is the song's LYRIC's recognition. If you've listened to a song for YEARS and never could make out a portion of the lyrics, than one day you do a tweak to your system and listen to that song and the "missing" words jump right out at you for the 1st time, then you KNOW beyond any doubt that THAT tweak was "real" and did in fact improve the fidelity of your system beyond any chance that it was just "wishful thinking". But not everyone is old enuff or listens to the same songs that much fo rthis test to "work"...whatever....the whole issue is a huge waste of time. No one's business but your own what you want to spend your "upgrade $'s" and TIME on. But it's later than you think... :lol:
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Re: DIY power cords and speaker wire

Post by engtaz » Thu Oct 14, 2010 7:49 pm

Trust that everyone that heard the 3 different amps on the power conditioner when the three amps sounded like shit. It was shocking. All 3 owners of the 3 different amps were shocked at how bad their amps sounded. Plugged straight into the wall the amps came back to life.
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Re: DIY power cords and speaker wire

Post by BillD » Thu Oct 14, 2010 8:01 pm

Using the exact same power cord that was plugged into the power conditioner, no doubt.
It should sound like it isn't there!
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Re: DIY power cords and speaker wire

Post by mbskeam » Thu Oct 14, 2010 9:23 pm

Ray,....
the cabin had no ceiling to speak of it was close to 25' plus
I have to think this is why your house set up sounds diffrent.
when I got back and put my test tract CD in that I heard in many diffrent types of setups....
mine has a sound all to itself....
mostly I think it was tha fact that my ceiling is 8' high.
not the open huge rooms in the cabins....
ribbons love space....I heard it there.....

or my stuff just sucks.... :lol: :lol: :lol:

as to the cords and interconnects, all I can say is...
too each there own.... :D :D :D
if it feels good do it......


but right now all I can afford is, top romin to eat....
damb this audio hobby all to hell..... :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
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Re: DIY power cords and speaker wire

Post by OconeeOrange » Thu Oct 14, 2010 9:38 pm

Magnaryder wrote:
I realize what we heard was not a power cord issue but the example might be used to understand how a limp-dick cord might effect the music.
Gotta Say I will be backing F1 on this. If we ever get to electing officers on CARVER - F1 gets my vote for Sgt At Arms as he is THE MAN. If he tells me to crush you - will have o do that 8)

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Re: DIY power cords and speaker wire

Post by Magnaryder » Thu Oct 14, 2010 9:45 pm

BillD wrote:Using the exact same power cord that was plugged into the power conditioner, no doubt.
No, my Lightstars were the only amps that had a removable PC, IIRC.

ray
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Re: DIY power cords and speaker wire

Post by F1nut » Thu Oct 14, 2010 11:22 pm

That said, one "acid test" that beats them all (re "tweaks") IMHO that us old farts (who tend to listen periodically to the same songs for many, many years and only gradually add new stuff) can use is the song's LYRIC's recognition. If you've listened to a song for YEARS and never could make out a portion of the lyrics, than one day you do a tweak to your system and listen to that song and the "missing" words jump right out at you for the 1st time, then you KNOW beyond any doubt that THAT tweak was "real" and did in fact improve the fidelity of your system beyond any chance that it was just "wishful thinking". But not everyone is old enuff or listens to the same songs that much fo rthis test to "work"...whatever....the whole issue is a huge waste of time.
Hot damn, I use the same "acid test" and the whole issue is far from a waste of time, Ed.
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Re: DIY power cords and speaker wire

Post by F1nut » Thu Oct 14, 2010 11:25 pm

OconeeOrange wrote:
Gotta Say I will be backing F1 on this. If we ever get to electing officers on CARVER - F1 gets my vote for Sgt At Arms as he is THE MAN. If he tells me to crush you - will have o do that 8)
I love it, thanks!
Last edited by F1nut on Thu Oct 14, 2010 11:30 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Political Correctness...defined

A doctrine fostered by a delusional, illogical minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end.



In a recent press conference, President Obama remarked, "If I had a city, it would look just like Detroit."

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Re: DIY power cords and speaker wire

Post by F1nut » Thu Oct 14, 2010 11:28 pm

Ray and Roy.....Roy and Ray.....

What brand/model of power conditioner?
Political Correctness...defined

A doctrine fostered by a delusional, illogical minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end.



In a recent press conference, President Obama remarked, "If I had a city, it would look just like Detroit."

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Re: DIY power cords and speaker wire

Post by TNRabbit » Fri Oct 15, 2010 3:33 am

F1nut wrote:
That said, one "acid test" that beats them all (re "tweaks") IMHO that us old farts (who tend to listen periodically to the same songs for many, many years and only gradually add new stuff) can use is the song's LYRIC's recognition. If you've listened to a song for YEARS and never could make out a portion of the lyrics, than one day you do a tweak to your system and listen to that song and the "missing" words jump right out at you for the 1st time, then you KNOW beyond any doubt that THAT tweak was "real" and did in fact improve the fidelity of your system beyond any chance that it was just "wishful thinking". But not everyone is old enuff or listens to the same songs that much fo rthis test to "work"...whatever....the whole issue is a huge waste of time.
Hot damn, I use the same "acid test" and the whole issue is far from a waste of time, Ed.
FYI to you both: I've found this "acid test" is sometimes nothing more than a recording that has been compressed. When you lose the dynamics, the soft whisper in your ear is almost the same level as the drummer pounding on the snare. So be careful about using previously unheard things in a song to determine that you've reached a new level in sonic ecstasy. I'm not saying this is an absolute, but compression can definitely cause this phenomenon.
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