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Lets talk about power....A/C power

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elgrau

SILVER-7 TUBE AMP

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Joined: Wed May 31, 2006 9:33 pm

Post Thu Apr 29, 2010 1:28 pm

Re: Lets talk about power....A/C power

Ok, Steve; I'll post the simple circut of this "current measurement" box that simply allows you to measure the current of a remote device (i.e., far away from your computer) by running a small gage wire from this device to your computer and using the aforementioned Radio Shack digital volt/current/resistance meter to send this measurement to software (supplied with meter) on your computer that then graphs this useage/measurement (in this case the total amperage of his system reduced down to one milliamp = one amp of actual current being drawn by the system). Otherwise you need to run the FULL size wire to your computer/meter setup because the meter has to be in series with the load of course (when measuring current) and this is very IMPRACTICAL when this distance is great (say over 10 feet!). Not to mention that most meters are fuse limited to 10 amps anyway, so you would not be able to measure this full current anyway (at least not on my meter which is 10 amp limited; hence the need to step it down and measure milliamps instead of the actual amps). Don't know how to make this any clearer so I'll give up now...

Was just trying to offer an alternative (i.e., an actual measurement) to just "guessing" how much PEAK current his system ACTUALLY draws during HIS normal useage of HIS system. Beyond that I don't really give a fuck!

Add: He might actually find that 99.99% of the time ONE 30 amp circut is more than adequate. And if you say "what about the 0.01% of the time that he needs MORE than 30 amps"? I say, well there will also be a smaller amount of time that he needs MORE than 60 amps as well! What about that?
Last edited by elgrau on Thu Apr 29, 2010 2:05 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Family room: 400 disk changer with PS Audio Digital Link III DAC; Technics SL-1100A TT. QED Quenx1 IC's from DAC & TT to Adcom GTP-602 preamp/Tuner. AudioQuest King Cobra IC's from preamp to M1.0t mk-II opt2. QED Silver Spirals 4M wires to EPI 1000’s.
Living room: AudioQuest Black Mamba 8M IC's from family room preamp to Barcus-Berry 2002R Sonic Maximizer to GlowPower Zyxt IC's to Sunfire 300x2 to Nordost 6M bi-source wires to AOS 28" MDF spherical speakers using six 8" woofers and eight 1" dome tweeters symm. arranged around the surface.
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stevewithrow

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SILVER-7t

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Location: Great NorthWest.....Carver Country..

Post Thu Apr 29, 2010 1:41 pm

Re: Lets talk about power....A/C power

elgrau wrote:Ok, Steve; I'll post the simple circut of this "current measurement" box that simply allows you to measure the current of a remote device (i.e., far away from your computer) by running a small gage wire from this device to your computer and using the aforementioned Radio Shack digital volt/current/resistance meter to send this measurement to software (supplied with meter) on your computer that then graphs this useage/measurement (in this case the total amperage of his system reduced down to one milliamp = one amp of actual current being drawn by the system). Otherwise you need to run the FULL size wire to your computer/meter setup because the meter has to be in series with the load of course (when measuring current) and this is very IMPRACTABLE when this distance is great (say over 10 feet!). Don't know how to make this any clearer so I'll give up now...

Was just trying to offer an alternative (i.e., an actual measurement) to just "guessing" how much PEAK current his system ACTUALLY draws during HIS normal useage of HIS system. Beyond that I don't really give a fuck!

I love your post man , they always put a smile on my face....!!!..its all good..And yes you do give a fuck..... :o
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Dr. W

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TFM-35

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Post Thu Apr 29, 2010 3:21 pm

Re: Lets talk about power....A/C power

Bruce forgive me if I came off wrong..My bad.. #-o ,,Commercial installation is a whole different monster..I do find it interesting you ( they ) allowed you to up-size the wire , but then again , I would have to be THERE to see why they allowed that. Some times on BIG 3 pole breakers you cab adjust them ( frequency )..All I am saying , in residential , you up size , or down size , use ..Be safe , use the RIGHT breaker for the job....We ALL want clean , big power for our systems.. Lets be smart and safe when doing so...Hire a licensed electrician ...


Steve, no offense taken and thanks for keeping us all safe.

Oh, let me make sure here. It is not a good idea to lick my fingers and stick them into the socket to see if it is hot? :lol: :lol:

Bruce
Bruce A Weiland, my system here -->> http://forum.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/fr.pl?vevol&1317958032&openmine&zzBruce_weiland&4&5#Bruce_weiland
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helicopterpilotdoug

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Post Thu Apr 29, 2010 9:26 pm

Re: Lets talk about power....A/C power

Thanks for all the reply's guys. Are 2-30 amp circuits beneficial in some way? The reason I ask is the total load can be divided into 2-20 amp and 1-15 amp circuits with quite a few watts left over. The way I divided it up, 20 amp circuit #1 has 2090 watts max, 20 amp circuit #2 has 2056 watts max, and the 15 amp circuit has 1130 watts max. I have 2-20 amp Furman powerport line conditioners, and with the addition of a 15 amp one, into an existing 15 amp circuit, I think I'd have everything covered. I guess what I'm getting at here is what if any advantage would I have by doing the 2-30 amp circuits? Also, is the plug a standard 3 prong plug for a 30 amp circuit outlet?
Sunfire: Theater Grand IV, Cinema Grand Signature.
Carver: TFM-45, PST-24 Cassette, Extra Carver Gear: CT-6, C-11 (S/N 00001).
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stevewithrow

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Post Fri Apr 30, 2010 9:38 am

Re: Lets talk about power....A/C power

Go with the 2-20 amp circuits...Dedicate them , Hire an electrician ( licensed ) Just don't go and through breakers in the panel .
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mbskeam

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Location: Woodinville Wa

Post Fri Apr 30, 2010 2:42 pm

Re: Lets talk about power....A/C power

Hire an electrician ( licensed ) Just don't go and through breakers in the panel .


why,
if ya do it to code, then it should be fine....right?
just a ????
me I'm kinda a hands on guy....LOL
I wont tell what I'm going to do....ya might yell at me...... 8-[ 8-[ 8-[ :D :D :D
Mbskeam


#1 BLACK BEAUTY's made by the man, the myth, the legend Bob Carver
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BillD

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(pair of) SILVER-7 TUBE AMPs

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Post Fri Apr 30, 2010 3:04 pm

Re: Lets talk about power....A/C power

Well, it's nothing you should fool with if you don't know what you're doing. It is why they license electricians. And when your house burns down, don't even think about collecting insurance if you did it yourself.
It should sound like it isn't there!
There is a difference between hearing and listening...
Making life enjoyable through expensive electronics.
_________________
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Sunfire:Theater Grand III processor, Ultimate Receiver, Cinema Grand Signature 400 ~ seven, True Subwoofer Mk. II, D-10 Subwoofer
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Jag_97470

SILVER-7 TUBE AMP

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Location: Oregon

Post Fri Apr 30, 2010 3:14 pm

Re: Lets talk about power....A/C power

When I decided to run 2 dedicated lines several people suggested what wire etc. to use. I know just enough to be dangerous so hired an electrician and helped him. I told him I would crawl under the house to run the wire if he could cut the cost? He about fainted! What! I have NEVER had a guy offer to crawl under the house for me! I did crawl under the house and ran the wire for him and he did everything else using his own new wire and good used breakers and only charged me a little over 100 bucks!
I do feel much safer knowing it was done right. If you are not sure about anything? hire someone!
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stevewithrow

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SILVER-7t

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Joined: Mon Aug 25, 2008 12:59 am

Location: Great NorthWest.....Carver Country..

Post Fri Apr 30, 2010 5:05 pm

Re: Lets talk about power....A/C power

mbskeam wrote:
Hire an electrician ( licensed ) Just don't go and through breakers in the panel .


why,
if ya do it to code, then it should be fine....right?
just a ????
me I'm kinda a hands on guy....LOL
I wont tell what I'm going to do....ya might yell at me...... 8-[ 8-[ 8-[ :D :D :D

Scares me when I hear stuff like this , you wanted advice , you got GOOD advice ..USE IT..!! [-X
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helicopterpilotdoug

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SILVER-7t

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Location: Austin TX

Post Fri Apr 30, 2010 6:29 pm

Re: Lets talk about power....A/C power

stevewithrow wrote:
mbskeam wrote:
Hire an electrician ( licensed ) Just don't go and through breakers in the panel .


why,
if ya do it to code, then it should be fine....right?
just a ????
me I'm kinda a hands on guy....LOL
I wont tell what I'm going to do....ya might yell at me...... 8-[ 8-[ 8-[ :D :D :D

Scares me when I hear stuff like this , you wanted advice , you got GOOD advice ..USE IT..!! [-X

Me, I don't know enough to be dangerous! I will for sure get a electrician to do this. I still have that question though. Is there any advantage to having 2-30 amp circuits installed? And if I did, is the plug different? I know a dryer connection is a different plug, and I think they are 30 amp. Also a travel trailer I had was 30 amp and the plug was just like a dryer plug.
Sunfire: Theater Grand IV, Cinema Grand Signature.
Carver: TFM-45, PST-24 Cassette, Extra Carver Gear: CT-6, C-11 (S/N 00001).
Polk Audio: Mains SRS 2.1TL, Center CSiA6, Surrounds FXiA6 and FXiA4, Sub DSW MicroPro 1000, Extra Speakers SDA 2A, SDA 2Btl, Monitor 10A.
Turntable: Dual CS 714Q
Bluray/SACD: Oppo BDP 83SE
CD: Sony 330 300 Disk changer

http://www.douglasconnection.com
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stevewithrow

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SILVER-7t

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Location: Great NorthWest.....Carver Country..

Post Fri Apr 30, 2010 7:41 pm

Re: Lets talk about power....A/C power

You know , I thought I seen one before ( Double duplex recept , 30 amp )..I know they make single pole 30 amp breakers , you would have to look around , but in general , they are twist locks...Also . you would have to ask your electrician in your area about that one...I would stick with the two 20 amp recepts myself...
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helicopterpilotdoug

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Joined: Sun Mar 21, 2010 8:04 pm

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Post Sat May 01, 2010 5:24 am

Re: Lets talk about power....A/C power

stevewithrow wrote:You know , I thought I seen one before ( Double duplex recept , 30 amp )..I know they make single pole 30 amp breakers , you would have to look around , but in general , they are twist locks...Also . you would have to ask your electrician in your area about that one...I would stick with the two 20 amp recepts myself...

Thanks Steve. I think that's the way I'll go.
Sunfire: Theater Grand IV, Cinema Grand Signature.
Carver: TFM-45, PST-24 Cassette, Extra Carver Gear: CT-6, C-11 (S/N 00001).
Polk Audio: Mains SRS 2.1TL, Center CSiA6, Surrounds FXiA6 and FXiA4, Sub DSW MicroPro 1000, Extra Speakers SDA 2A, SDA 2Btl, Monitor 10A.
Turntable: Dual CS 714Q
Bluray/SACD: Oppo BDP 83SE
CD: Sony 330 300 Disk changer

http://www.douglasconnection.com
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basspig

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TFM-6cb

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Location: Connecticut, USA

Post Mon Jun 14, 2010 8:50 pm

Re: Lets talk about power....A/C power

stevewithrow wrote:You would NEVER use # 8 wire to feed rececpts , unless maybe you have a sub panel out in you garage and you have a compressor or welder ( thats another whole story ) .As far as you feeds coming in . 2 120 feeders ( not 110 , put an amp probe on them , if your getting 110 , you are in trouble )...they would be on phases ( a-b )

Not my 2 cents , I have only been doing this for 17 years...When it comes to people telling others how to wire there house with NO experience ( or licensee ) bugs the fuck out of me.. :x



Not to hijaack this thread, but I'm running 220vac to the racks that house my amplifiers, pre-amps and signal processing and use #6awg wiring (doubled up) from the main panel to feed a 50A electric dryer type outlet. The racks with the amplifiers use a 50A line cord and plug that matches the outlet. I have two grounds on this system: a safety ground and a common or return "ground" which is technically not really a ground.
This was quite necessary when you have two very large industrial 7,000-watt amplifiers that each can pull 93A when running at full power and four smaller high-powered amps that each can pull 18A at full power. That's 129 amps on each leg of the 220 feed. Of course, due to crest factor of music, actual draw will only be about 1/9th of that typically and normally a LOT less than even that. I have a lot of problems with my lights dimming and my neighbors' lights down the block dimming when I play very loud here.
Take care,

Mark & Mary Ann Weiss
http://www.basspig.com The Bass Pig's Lair - 16,500 watts of driving surround sound!

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stevewithrow

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SILVER-7t

Posts: 1327

Joined: Mon Aug 25, 2008 12:59 am

Location: Great NorthWest.....Carver Country..

Post Mon Jun 14, 2010 8:58 pm

Re: Lets talk about power....A/C power

basspig wrote:
stevewithrow wrote:You would NEVER use # 8 wire to feed rececpts , unless maybe you have a sub panel out in you garage and you have a compressor or welder ( thats another whole story ) .As far as you feeds coming in . 2 120 feeders ( not 110 , put an amp probe on them , if your getting 110 , you are in trouble )...they would be on phases ( a-b )

Not my 2 cents , I have only been doing this for 17 years...When it comes to people telling others how to wire there house with NO experience ( or licensee ) bugs the fuck out of me.. :x



Not to hijaack this thread, but I'm running 220vac to the racks that house my amplifiers, pre-amps and signal processing and use #6awg wiring (doubled up) from the main panel to feed a 50A electric dryer type outlet. The racks with the amplifiers use a 50A line cord and plug that matches the outlet. I have two grounds on this system: a safety ground and a common or return "ground" which is technically not really a ground.
This was quite necessary when you have two very large industrial 7,000-watt amplifiers that each can pull 93A when running at full power and four smaller high-powered amps that each can pull 18A at full power. That's 129 amps on each leg of the 220 feed. Of course, due to crest factor of music, actual draw will only be about 1/9th of that typically and normally a LOT less than even that. I have a lot of problems with my lights dimming and my neighbors' lights down the block dimming when I play very loud here.

That is crazy to say the least......I would love to hear your system.... *5*
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treitz3

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"Julian"
"Julian"

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Location: The tube lair in Charlotte, NC

Post Mon Jun 14, 2010 9:00 pm

Re: Lets talk about power....A/C power

You don't even need to hear his rig to know what it's capable of. Have you ever taken a Magic Carpet ride? :-D
In search of accurate reproduction of music. Real sound is my reference and while perfection may not be attainable? If I chase it, I might just catch excellence.

The best way to enjoy digital music reproduction is to never listen to a good analogue reproduction.

Robert R. - "Did you see my North Korea analogy? I should have named it Carversite.kim"
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