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Lets talk about power....A/C power

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basspig

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Post Tue Jun 15, 2010 1:19 am

Re: Lets talk about power....A/C power

Felt more than heard, sometimes.
A friend loaned me a DVD "The Mighty Saturns" from Spacecraft Films, containing original footage of the Saturn 1-5 rocket launches. The 2nd disc in the 3-disc set has significant infrasonic content. I was watching it at relatively low volume, when I felt the concrete shuddering beneath my feet, during one of the launches.
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Mark & Mary Ann Weiss
http://www.basspig.com The Bass Pig's Lair - 16,500 watts of driving surround sound!

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helicopterpilotdoug

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Post Tue Jun 15, 2010 3:55 am

Re: Lets talk about power....A/C power

basspig wrote:
stevewithrow wrote:You would NEVER use # 8 wire to feed rececpts , unless maybe you have a sub panel out in you garage and you have a compressor or welder ( thats another whole story ) .As far as you feeds coming in . 2 120 feeders ( not 110 , put an amp probe on them , if your getting 110 , you are in trouble )...they would be on phases ( a-b )

Not my 2 cents , I have only been doing this for 17 years...When it comes to people telling others how to wire there house with NO experience ( or licensee ) bugs the fuck out of me.. :x



Not to hijaack this thread, but I'm running 220vac to the racks that house my amplifiers, pre-amps and signal processing and use #6awg wiring (doubled up) from the main panel to feed a 50A electric dryer type outlet. The racks with the amplifiers use a 50A line cord and plug that matches the outlet. I have two grounds on this system: a safety ground and a common or return "ground" which is technically not really a ground.
This was quite necessary when you have two very large industrial 7,000-watt amplifiers that each can pull 93A when running at full power and four smaller high-powered amps that each can pull 18A at full power. That's 129 amps on each leg of the 220 feed. Of course, due to crest factor of music, actual draw will only be about 1/9th of that typically and normally a LOT less than even that. I have a lot of problems with my lights dimming and my neighbors' lights down the block dimming when I play very loud here.

Now that some heavy duty amplification! :shock:
Sunfire: Theater Grand IV, Cinema Grand Signature.
Carver: TFM-45, PST-24 Cassette, Extra Carver Gear: CT-6, C-11 (S/N 00001).
Polk Audio: Mains SRS 2.1TL, Center CSiA6, Surrounds FXiA6 and FXiA4, Sub DSW MicroPro 1000, Extra Speakers SDA 2A, SDA 2Btl, Monitor 10A.
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Scarabeo

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Post Sat Dec 11, 2010 11:12 pm

Re: Lets talk about power....A/C power

BillD wrote:Well, it's nothing you should fool with if you don't know what you're doing. It is why they license electricians. And when your house burns down, don't even think about collecting insurance if you did it yourself.
What if your a renter? :D I am thinking of doing this. Should I lick my fingers and test it or just put my tongue there like a sweet women?

OK I am doing it and calling a Electrician now that I have a spot for Audio that should not change.
BillD, You will be forever with us! RIP until we meet again on the other side...
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Dr. W

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Post Sun Dec 12, 2010 8:52 am

Re: Lets talk about power....A/C power

Wait! =;

Don't tell me you are calling the electrician, BEFORE testing with your tong. :rolleyes:

Well that's just a waste of money. :lol:
Bruce A Weiland, my system here -->> http://forum.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/fr.pl?vevol&1317958032&openmine&zzBruce_weiland&4&5#Bruce_weiland
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Rainman

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Post Thu Dec 16, 2010 1:26 am

Re: Lets talk about power....A/C power

This has been an ongoing topic with many people for a very very long time. Once again my comments are not intended to insult anyone's intelligence or knowledge regarding this topic, however there are a few things that should be considered.
First, there is always the mention of that won't be up to "Code". This is something that is taken as the golden law on how things must be done. In some cases this is complete B.S. Code is written with the idea of creating a standardized safe installation procedure, and is written by people who unfortunately do not know nearly enough about how modern day things really work. For example why does "code" still mandate the use of straight slot screws in almost everything? The most important thing to know about "code" is that the people who write it have absolutely NO regard or consideration for what will be plugged into or connected to the lines or circuits that are mandated by their "code". As long as the building is up to "code" they don't care if what you plug into a recept will function properly much less work at all. Go ahead and ask them they will tell you if it doesn't work right when you plug it in then what ever you are plugging in has an issue and should be addressed as so. Best example: They couldn't care less if your TFM45 will never work on a circuit that's "code" when it's simply because of it's power up process. There is no safety issue there and no problem with the equipment, but you can't use it on a circuit that they consider "code". So keep that in mind. When dealing with issues like installing safe dedicated circuits for stereo gear and always use common fricking sense over whatever "code" says.
I am also surprised that no one mentioned using true isolated ground "hospital grade" 20a outlets which are perfectly acceptable to "code". The other thing that you might consider when selecting your type & gauge of wire (code or not) is using an isolated 3 wire of whatever gauge you choose. I know there will be some who say that's a bunch of crap, but there is no down side to doing this other than some will say it's not needed and is a waste of $$. So if some will dispute the upside to doing it, but can't give a downside to it why not do it? As I have said before, if you walk into any cell site, or t.v. broadcast site even the $hitter vent fan is done with an isolated 3 wire! Trust me the people at Motorola, Erricson, and Nortel know a little more about amplification and the properties of electricity than the geniuses who write your local electrical "code". Our local electrical "code" has been a huge issue so many times in powering and wiring cell sites right up until the F.C.C. informs the genius holding the Dunkin Doughnut in one hand and "code" book in the other that F.C.C. guidelines don't care about their comic book with it's pencil & eraser.

Rainman
Question: Do you know why turds are tapered on the ends? Answer: So your asshole doesn't slam shut..

Carver- SDA490t, SDA450, 2 TFM45's, TFM15, CT23, CT28v, CT27v, Linn Kaber speakers, Sunfire crm2's, PS Audio Statement speaker cables and I/C's, A.P.C. power
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Dr. W

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Post Thu Dec 16, 2010 8:24 am

Re: Lets talk about power....A/C power

Rainman ought to be tarred and feathered and run out of town on a rail!!! :lol:

He is not just suggesting, but absolutely recommending that rather than take a local, city, county, state, or national, governmental publication as gospel, we actually THINK. [-X

What is next? Being responsible for ourselves? #-o

Where did we get this guy anyway? :?

NICE POST =D>

Bruce
Bruce A Weiland, my system here -->> http://forum.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/fr.pl?vevol&1317958032&openmine&zzBruce_weiland&4&5#Bruce_weiland
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Magic_Physicist

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Post Fri Dec 17, 2010 4:27 pm

Re: Lets talk about power....A/C power

Battle of the Electricians

A new tv show on the Discovery Channel 8)

One thing for sure....they are like finger prints.....no two are alike.

Like I said before I have been getting shocked since 1963 when I grabbed a power supply on Dad's bench when he was building an oscilloscope.

He was the Head of Systems Operation at Puget Sound Power & Light until he retired and my grandfather also worked for PPS&L until he retired.

Which is probably what got me started and later made them say "WHAT?" when talking about circuit boards and semiconductors we have been giving "Murphy's Law" to since the old timers went to the golf pastures :lol:

Now here at my place where I have lived for over 25 years I always do all the wiring since on 5 acres the buildings and other things are spread all over the place and are things I don't call a county inspector (aka dip shit) to look at.

I actually got my first look at what an electrician and the county inspector do when I had my current house built here 8 years ago so I watched this supposed journeyman electrician and our county inspector do their thing.

Everything passed the code but to this day I still have not repaired all their fuck-ups...some but not all since I would rather not mess with the sheet rock but one of his fuck-ups is upstairs in my future sound-room where the outlet and junction do not work but hey he did make the one light socket with the pull-string work :rolleyes:


So after he did come back once to fix one screw up he was then fired by the company he worked for.

He did forget his nice extension ladder here once.......thanks for the ladder you dip shit 8)

So since then I do all of my goofy electrical projects here and ones I did back around 20 years ago still work fine and haven't burned down my garage full of my favorite toys with wheels.
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OconeeOrange

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Post Fri Dec 17, 2010 5:09 pm

Re: Lets talk about power....A/C power

Dr. W wrote:Rainman ought to be tarred and feathered and run out of town on a rail!!! :lol:

He is not just suggesting, but absolutely recommending that rather than take a local, city, county, state, or national, governmental publication as gospel, we actually THINK. [-X

What is next? Being responsible for ourselves? #-o

Where did we get this guy anyway? :?

NICE POST =D>

Bruce



To that end, the next house all of us build will be audio friendly with the best electrics.
Till then, us guys in the South are famous for saying "Watch this". :shock:

I never want to move again. I have good wiring.

I am still not convinced that super wiring influences the sound of music that much.
Sure, you want a (maybe a few) dedicated line to cull hum, but beyond that, most other crap is a waste.

As to high dollar power cords, ever look inside at the tiny wire inside your components?? :D

Maybe on interconnects you need a super cable ( ](*,) ) All agree speaker wire needs less as the signal is so much stronger.

Put you tongue to an interconnect, to a speaker wire and then to a power cord. Then describe the strongest signal.

Maybe super products beyond basic electricity add to the sound, but I would suspect it is hard to hear.

I do have a power conditioner/battery back up, but I live back in the woods where blips and outages are normal. That cured the problems in my music, and and runs my weather station for hours when the power goes out. http://I'm a Fucking Asshole.typepad.com/ycweather/
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Scarabeo

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Post Sat Dec 18, 2010 2:01 am

Re: Lets talk about power....A/C power

OconeeOrange wrote:
Put you tongue to an interconnect, to a speaker wire and then to a power cord. Then describe the strongest signal.

:oops: its

the

P o w e r
c
o
r
d
:-?
BillD, You will be forever with us! RIP until we meet again on the other side...
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Rainman

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Post Sat Dec 18, 2010 7:20 am

Re: Lets talk about power....A/C power

Dr. W wrote: He is not just suggesting, but absolutely recommending that rather than take a local, city, county, state, or national, governmental publication as gospel, we actually THINK. [-X
What is next? Being responsible for ourselves? #-o

Bruce


Bruce, I commend you for your thoughts, but first of all there is no way they will ever again let anyone think for themselves! There would be an uprising that would make the civil war look like a kids book reading on Mister Rogers Neighborhood. Second, unfortunately there are way too many people who are convinced they can do no wrong and therefore everything must be the fault of someone else. A good example of someone not being responsible for their actions (a.k.a. being a dumbass) is the dip shit who's Prius malfunctioned and he could not manage to stop it. He had the presence of mind to grab his cell phone, call the cops, and carry on a conversation (before the crash) with the emergency operator for more than 1 minute describing to her how the car would not stop. He sure knew how to use his phone during all of this, but never thought to downshift then shut the key off and finish stopping the thing by stepping on the brake and pulling the E brake. I agree that the malfunction of the car is Toyota's fault, but the accident resulting from the malfunction is totally his fault & why? Because he was too busy talking on his cell phone to stop the damn car! The moral of the story is things like electrical code are a great idea except sooner or later it will be infiltrated by people who have no common sense and have somehow landed in a position in which they are making decisions for people who are capable of thinking for themselves. I know you can't teach common sense, all I can pray for is those of you who are blessed with it, for God's sake please use it!

Rainman
Question: Do you know why turds are tapered on the ends? Answer: So your asshole doesn't slam shut..

Carver- SDA490t, SDA450, 2 TFM45's, TFM15, CT23, CT28v, CT27v, Linn Kaber speakers, Sunfire crm2's, PS Audio Statement speaker cables and I/C's, A.P.C. power
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Dr. W

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Post Sat Dec 18, 2010 11:24 am

Re: Lets talk about power....A/C power

Well Rainman, I am sure I have identified at least one of YOUR problems.

You are not blissful. [-X

And that is entirely YOUR fault for NOT being ignorant. #-o (Just one of the curses of a thinking person, and once you have gone down that road, there is no going back)

"Ignorance IS bliss". O:)

Bruce
Bruce A Weiland, my system here -->> http://forum.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/fr.pl?vevol&1317958032&openmine&zzBruce_weiland&4&5#Bruce_weiland
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Rainman

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Post Sun Dec 19, 2010 2:01 pm

Re: Lets talk about power....A/C power

Dr. W wrote: (Just one of the curses of a thinking person, and once you have gone down that road, there is no going back)

Bruce


Bruce, as you probably know they give most people medicine/drugs to stop this these days, but I could never be a "sheeple" because I am allergic to wool. :lol: Thanks for thinking so highly of me, just don't tell anyone because I have an image to uphold :D

Rainman
Question: Do you know why turds are tapered on the ends? Answer: So your asshole doesn't slam shut..

Carver- SDA490t, SDA450, 2 TFM45's, TFM15, CT23, CT28v, CT27v, Linn Kaber speakers, Sunfire crm2's, PS Audio Statement speaker cables and I/C's, A.P.C. power
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Scarabeo

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Post Fri Dec 24, 2010 3:39 am

Re: Lets talk about power....A/C power

Rainman wrote: I know you can't teach common sense, all I can pray for is those of you who are blessed with it, for God's sake please use it!

Rainman[/color]

=D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D>
Why do they call it that when its not so common?
BillD, You will be forever with us! RIP until we meet again on the other side...
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Dr. W

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Post Fri Dec 24, 2010 12:00 pm

Re: Lets talk about power....A/C power

because it ought to be. ](*,)
Bruce A Weiland, my system here -->> http://forum.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/fr.pl?vevol&1317958032&openmine&zzBruce_weiland&4&5#Bruce_weiland
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Dr. W

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Post Fri Dec 24, 2010 12:03 pm

Re: Lets talk about power....A/C power

Rainman wrote:
Dr. W wrote: (Just one of the curses of a thinking person, and once you have gone down that road, there is no going back)

Bruce


..... Thanks for thinking so highly of me, just don't tell anyone because I have an image to uphold :D

Rainman


I like to acknowledge people who "claim" to be able to think, who ACTUALLY demonstrate that they can, and DO. =D>
Bruce A Weiland, my system here -->> http://forum.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/fr.pl?vevol&1317958032&openmine&zzBruce_weiland&4&5#Bruce_weiland
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