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Carver Plats vs. Martin Logan Vantage--*Help*

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jck

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Post Mon Jun 06, 2011 9:32 pm

Carver Plats vs. Martin Logan Vantage--*Help*

I'm looking at both but am a fan of carver. Its been 20+ years since I listened to a pair of AML...
I have the room, amp, etc. I need suggestions, input, value...etc
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TNRabbit

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Location: TN Native Languishing in VA

Post Tue Jun 07, 2011 6:24 am

Re: Carver Plats vs. Martin Logan Vantage--*Help*

Personally, for the money, I would take the Amazings.
TNRabbit
Image

From FrankieD's lips to your ears: Sunfire - a quiet box of endless power.

Sunfire TG-IV/400~7 Amp
Carver SD/A-360 CDP
Benchmark DAC-1
Sony SACD/DVD-A
Active bi-amp: Ashly XR-1001 & 2 Rane PEQ-15s
Main: HotRodded AL-IIIs
Sub: Klipsch RT-12d
Center: Sunfire CRS-3c
Surround: Sunfire CRS-3 (x 2)

OconeeOrange wrote:"Gary likes to play it 'loud' as do I. His system begs you turn it up until you die"

RIP WIlliam B. Dibble, 1948-2012. I'll miss you my friend.
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BillD

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(pair of) SILVER-7 TUBE AMPs

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Location: The west's most mid-western town, Scottsdale, Arizona

Post Tue Jun 07, 2011 10:23 am

Re: Carver Plats vs. Martin Logan Vantage--*Help*

If you can afford BIG MLs, go for it, but Amazings, especially Plats, are dollar-for-dollar far better. You have to spend the really big bucks to get equivalent performance elsewhere.
It should sound like it isn't there!
There is a difference between hearing and listening...
Making life enjoyable through expensive electronics.
_________________
Carver: C-4000 & C-1 preamps, PSC-60 preamp/tuner, TX-11a tuner, M-400 (2), C-500, M-500, M-500t, M-500t Mk.II, A-500x, AL-III loudspeakers (2 pr.)
Sunfire:Theater Grand III processor, Ultimate Receiver, Cinema Grand Signature 400 ~ seven, True Subwoofer Mk. II, D-10 Subwoofer
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OconeeOrange

SILVER-7 TUBE AMP

Posts: 4488

Joined: Sat Mar 28, 2009 6:24 pm

Post Tue Jun 07, 2011 11:31 am

Re: Carver Plats vs. Martin Logan Vantage--*Help*

I looked around for the Plats for a year or so mainly just to fit in with the crowd here. I had no luck and was about ready to buy the ML ESL Motion speakers.

I recently got a pair of these instead: http://www.definitivetech.com/products/products.aspx?path=Speakers%20By%20Series|Mythos%20Series&productid=Mythos%20ST%20SuperTower

To me they sound good. I have and have had a lot of speakers, but none like this. I think they are a good example of speaker science improving over the years, as well as materials.

The true test of speakers (and systems) for me is not just to play loud, but to play at low levels accurately.

These are in a large room. If I took you in blind folded to the middle, I doubt you could point to the speakers as I have them about 20 foot apart and the sound stage is huge, room for the entire orchestra to have a seat.

I was intending to buy ML ELS Motion and a better sub than my Polk MicroPro 1000. I got a deal on these Def Tecs, and at least for me, have no need of a sub now at all. I have the Polk hooked in, but since this is just for music, it is mostly dead. So you could factor not needing a sub into the cost. You do have to run a power cord to each speaker.

These are tall enough for the high and mids to be above pool table height, and the low end below that is not a sonic problem. The are heavy speakers, so finding their place in the room is no fun. :lol:

I am very happy with these after a couple weeks. It is hard now for me to think I could have made a better choice. It is also good to know these would also be happy if I ever acquire a tube amp which might be lower power since on my budget Bob's Black Beauties are out - :lol:

You can NEVER have it all in one system, so everyone must eventually make choices, and that means choosing priorities.
Anyone who says otherwise is either very ignorant or lying.
- Arthur Salvatore



Dimensions | Metric :51-1/2" H x 9-1/2" D x 6-3/4" W | 130.8 x 24.1 x 17.1 cm
Height with Base | Metric :53" | 134.6 cm
Base Dimensions | Metric :11-1/2" W x 15-5/8" D | 29.2 x 36.5 cm
Driver Complement :One 1" pure aluminum dome tweeter; Two 5-1/4" BDSS midrange drivers; One 6" x 10" long-throw racetrack subwoofer pressure coupled to two 6" x 10" long-throw racetrack radiators.
Frequency Response :14 Hz – 30 kHz
Impedance :Compatible with 8 Ohms outputs
Sensitivity :93 dB
Recommended Associated Amplifier Power :20 – 350 watts
A/V Receiver Crossover Setting :Large; Full Bandwidth
Internal Amplifier Power :300 watts
Auto On / Off :Signal Sensing (US) | Signal Sensing and Switched (International)
Power Requirements :110 volts Alternating Current (US) | 220 volts Alternating Current (International)
Inputs :One pair of 5 way binding posts; One LFE input (optional)
Fuse :3.2 amp 250 volt Slo Blo (US) | 2 amp 250 volt Slo Blo (International)
Enclosure :Aircraft grade extruded aluminum
Available Finishes :Gloss Black
Base :Granite
Accessories :Plastic foot tippers; Isolation spikes
Packaging :One to a carton
Weight | Metric :80 lbs | 36.3 kg
Warranty :5 Years; 3 Years for Amplifiers

mythosst.jpg
mythosst.jpg (66.22 KiB) Viewed 1915 times
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Scarabeo

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SILVER-7 TUBE AMP

Posts: 2655

Joined: Tue Nov 18, 2008 6:05 pm

Post Tue Jun 07, 2011 2:40 pm

Re: Carver Plats vs. Martin Logan Vantage--*Help*

BillD wrote:If you can afford BIG MLs, go for it, but Amazings, especially Plats, are dollar-for-dollar far better. You have to spend the really big bucks to get equivalent performance elsewhere.

That's about it in a nut shell. I sold my Plat's but only cause I am stuck with a place that does not have the room for them anymore. If I ever move I will get another pair cause they do everything well and most other speakers lack something where Plat's do not.
BillD, You will be forever with us! RIP until we meet again on the other side...
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Don

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(pair of) SILVER-7t's

Posts: 2162

Joined: Tue Oct 28, 2008 10:46 am

Post Tue Jun 07, 2011 3:27 pm

Re: Carver Plats vs. Martin Logan Vantage--*Help*

BillD wrote:If you can afford BIG MLs, go for it, but Amazings, especially Plats, are dollar-for-dollar far better. You have to spend the really big bucks to get equivalent performance elsewhere.



Agree 100%. Speak from experience. I had to spend really big bucks to do better than my Plat 4's as mains. Now using them as dual center channels. Plat's just don't bring enough on the used market to justify letting them go for this ole boy. They do everything pretty darn good: from lows to highs, not to mention vocals and the mid-range, where they really shine. Been part of the family since new.
To argue with a person who has renounced the use of reason is like administering medicine to the dead.
— Thomas Paine


"Try not to become a man of success, but rather a man of value" Albert Einstein

"Politicians are the only people in the world who create problems and then campaign against them". Charlie Reese

"The problems we face today exist because the people who work for a living are outnumbered by those who vote for a living." Brad Shurett


"Kindness is a language that the Deaf can hear and the Blind can see." Mark Twain

RIP Bill D.
<<

TNRabbit

User avatar

(pair of) SILVER-7 TUBE AMPs

Posts: 13342

Joined: Sun Jan 14, 2007 11:53 am

Location: TN Native Languishing in VA

Post Tue Jun 07, 2011 3:44 pm

Re: Carver Plats vs. Martin Logan Vantage--*Help*

HOLY FUCK...dual Plats as a center channel??? What in the hell do you use for Mains???!?!!????
TNRabbit
Image

From FrankieD's lips to your ears: Sunfire - a quiet box of endless power.

Sunfire TG-IV/400~7 Amp
Carver SD/A-360 CDP
Benchmark DAC-1
Sony SACD/DVD-A
Active bi-amp: Ashly XR-1001 & 2 Rane PEQ-15s
Main: HotRodded AL-IIIs
Sub: Klipsch RT-12d
Center: Sunfire CRS-3c
Surround: Sunfire CRS-3 (x 2)

OconeeOrange wrote:"Gary likes to play it 'loud' as do I. His system begs you turn it up until you die"

RIP WIlliam B. Dibble, 1948-2012. I'll miss you my friend.
<<

Don

User avatar

(pair of) SILVER-7t's

Posts: 2162

Joined: Tue Oct 28, 2008 10:46 am

Post Tue Jun 07, 2011 4:12 pm

Re: Carver Plats vs. Martin Logan Vantage--*Help*

TNRabbit wrote:HOLY FUCK...dual Plats as a center channel??? What in the hell do you use for Mains???!?!!????



Silly Wabbit,

These are what replaced my Plat's as mains after 18 years or so:

http://www.legacyaudio.com/index.php?It ... item_id=93

http://stereomojo.com/Legacy%20WhisperX ... Review.htm
To argue with a person who has renounced the use of reason is like administering medicine to the dead.
— Thomas Paine


"Try not to become a man of success, but rather a man of value" Albert Einstein

"Politicians are the only people in the world who create problems and then campaign against them". Charlie Reese

"The problems we face today exist because the people who work for a living are outnumbered by those who vote for a living." Brad Shurett


"Kindness is a language that the Deaf can hear and the Blind can see." Mark Twain

RIP Bill D.
<<

Don

User avatar

(pair of) SILVER-7t's

Posts: 2162

Joined: Tue Oct 28, 2008 10:46 am

Post Tue Jun 07, 2011 4:36 pm

Re: Carver Plats vs. Martin Logan Vantage--*Help*

OconeeOrange wrote:I looked around for the Plats for a year or so mainly just to fit in with the crowd here. I had no luck and was about ready to buy the ML ESL Motion speakers.

I recently got a pair of these instead: http://www.definitivetech.com/products/products.aspx?path=Speakers%20By%20Series|Mythos%20Series&productid=Mythos%20ST%20SuperTower

To me they sound good. I have and have had a lot of speakers, but none like this. I think they are a good example of speaker science improving over the years, as well as materials.

The true test of speakers (and systems) for me is not just to play loud, but to play at low levels accurately.

These are in a large room. If I took you in blind folded to the middle, I doubt you could point to the speakers as I have them about 20 foot apart and the sound stage is huge, room for the entire orchestra to have a seat.

I was intending to buy ML ELS Motion and a better sub than my Polk MicroPro 1000. I got a deal on these Def Tecs, and at least for me, have no need of a sub now at all. I have the Polk hooked in, but since this is just for music, it is mostly dead. So you could factor not needing a sub into the cost. You do have to run a power cord to each speaker.

These are tall enough for the high and mids to be above pool table height, and the low end below that is not a sonic problem. The are heavy speakers, so finding their place in the room is no fun. :lol:

I am very happy with these after a couple weeks. It is hard now for me to think I could have made a better choice. It is also good to know these would also be happy if I ever acquire a tube amp which might be lower power since on my budget Bob's Black Beauties are out - :lol:

You can NEVER have it all in one system, so everyone must eventually make choices, and that means choosing priorities.
Anyone who says otherwise is either very ignorant or lying.
- Arthur Salvatore



Dimensions | Metric :51-1/2" H x 9-1/2" D x 6-3/4" W | 130.8 x 24.1 x 17.1 cm
Height with Base | Metric :53" | 134.6 cm
Base Dimensions | Metric :11-1/2" W x 15-5/8" D | 29.2 x 36.5 cm
Driver Complement :One 1" pure aluminum dome tweeter; Two 5-1/4" BDSS midrange drivers; One 6" x 10" long-throw racetrack subwoofer pressure coupled to two 6" x 10" long-throw racetrack radiators.
Frequency Response :14 Hz – 30 kHz
Impedance :Compatible with 8 Ohms outputs
Sensitivity :93 dB
Recommended Associated Amplifier Power :20 – 350 watts
A/V Receiver Crossover Setting :Large; Full Bandwidth
Internal Amplifier Power :300 watts
Auto On / Off :Signal Sensing (US) | Signal Sensing and Switched (International)
Power Requirements :110 volts Alternating Current (US) | 220 volts Alternating Current (International)
Inputs :One pair of 5 way binding posts; One LFE input (optional)
Fuse :3.2 amp 250 volt Slo Blo (US) | 2 amp 250 volt Slo Blo (International)
Enclosure :Aircraft grade extruded aluminum
Available Finishes :Gloss Black
Base :Granite
Accessories :Plastic foot tippers; Isolation spikes
Packaging :One to a carton
Weight | Metric :80 lbs | 36.3 kg
Warranty :5 Years; 3 Years for Amplifiers

mythosst.jpg



Double 0,

Heard a pair of DT Mythos in South Florida. Bought a pair of used PSB Stratus Gold I's from the gentleman that he replaced the Mythos with. Just listened to them for a casual few minutes. But quick take, they sounded very nice, open and airy. Nice soundstage.

Was anxious to get back on the road, so it was a quick pick up and out.
To argue with a person who has renounced the use of reason is like administering medicine to the dead.
— Thomas Paine


"Try not to become a man of success, but rather a man of value" Albert Einstein

"Politicians are the only people in the world who create problems and then campaign against them". Charlie Reese

"The problems we face today exist because the people who work for a living are outnumbered by those who vote for a living." Brad Shurett


"Kindness is a language that the Deaf can hear and the Blind can see." Mark Twain

RIP Bill D.
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kingman

User avatar

(pair of) SILVER-7 TUBE AMPs

Posts: 5747

Joined: Sun Nov 30, 2008 2:10 pm

Location: Upstate South Carolina

Post Tue Jun 07, 2011 6:38 pm

Re: Carver Plats vs. Martin Logan Vantage--*Help*

TNRabbit wrote:HOLY FUCK...dual Plats as a center channel??? What in the hell do you use for Mains???!?!!????

Where you been Gary???? Old news......
In reality, it only matters what it sounds like to YOU!!!
<<

Martin1970

User avatar

TFM-25

Posts: 359

Joined: Sat Mar 06, 2010 5:44 pm

Location: Savannah, GA

Post Wed Jun 08, 2011 7:45 am

Re: Carver Plats vs. Martin Logan Vantage--*Help*

TNRabbit wrote:HOLY FUCK...dual Plats as a center channel??? What in the hell do you use for Mains???!?!!????


I remember waiting patiently for Don to get those Whispers so I could try to buy his perfect set of plats.
There probably won't ever be someone that close to Savannah thinking about selling a set that nice.
At least not in my lifetime.
Then he decided to center-channel them.
And his wife let him!
Talk about the luckiest man alive...
Carver: ALS plat upgrades, TX-11a, C-9, C-1
Sunfire: Cinema Grand Sig 400 Seven x2
Rane: RPM88 26Z x3
<<

rah

M-400t CUBE

Posts: 150

Joined: Sun Jan 02, 2011 9:51 pm

Location: Houston TX

Post Wed Jun 08, 2011 9:16 am

Re: Carver Plats vs. Martin Logan Vantage--*Help*

Don wrote:
TNRabbit wrote:HOLY FUCK...dual Plats as a center channel??? What in the hell do you use for Mains???!?!!????



Silly Wabbit,

These are what replaced my Plat's as mains after 18 years or so:

http://www.legacyaudio.com/index.php?It ... item_id=93

http://stereomojo.com/Legacy%20WhisperX ... Review.htm

Do you have pictures of your setup?
My office (and only) system:
Sunfire Ultimate Receiver (thanks jjptkd!)
Sunfire Theater Grand Processor (with original remote!)
Carver TD-1770
Klipsch Chorus II's
Sony CA70ES 5-disc changer
Sony SACD 5-disc changer
<<

Don

User avatar

(pair of) SILVER-7t's

Posts: 2162

Joined: Tue Oct 28, 2008 10:46 am

Post Wed Jun 08, 2011 2:14 pm

Re: Carver Plats vs. Martin Logan Vantage--*Help*

Martin1970 wrote:
TNRabbit wrote:HOLY FUCK...dual Plats as a center channel??? What in the hell do you use for Mains???!?!!????


I remember waiting patiently for Don to get those Whispers so I could try to buy his perfect set of plats.
There probably won't ever be someone that close to Savannah thinking about selling a set that nice.
At least not in my lifetime.
Then he decided to center-channel them.
And his wife let him!
Talk about the luckiest man alive...



Martin,

One of these days I am going to talk Bill D. into sending me a Legacy Marquis HD center channel to compare against my Plats if we can sharpen the pencil enough. If I like the blend of the Marquis HD center channel with my Whisper XD's over the Plats, I will keep you in mind. It is very hard to part with a family member that has been so good to me over the years. I suspect The Marquis HD will have a tall order.

http://www.legacyaudio.com/index.php?It ... item_id=11

Rah,

I really don't know how to send pictures that are not gigantic. Not real computer literate. Eddie was kind enough to re-size them for me last time.

Currently waiting for Direct TV to come to house and add another HD receiver so things are a bit array right now as my home run is behind my 67" Sammy. One of these days I will get on the stick and learn a bit more regarding the upload to the site and re-sizing. Other priorities right now with Mother in Law in declining health and in facility.

Don
To argue with a person who has renounced the use of reason is like administering medicine to the dead.
— Thomas Paine


"Try not to become a man of success, but rather a man of value" Albert Einstein

"Politicians are the only people in the world who create problems and then campaign against them". Charlie Reese

"The problems we face today exist because the people who work for a living are outnumbered by those who vote for a living." Brad Shurett


"Kindness is a language that the Deaf can hear and the Blind can see." Mark Twain

RIP Bill D.
<<

BillD

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Posts: 7295

Joined: Wed Jun 06, 2007 8:29 pm

Location: The west's most mid-western town, Scottsdale, Arizona

Post Wed Jun 08, 2011 2:39 pm

Re: Carver Plats vs. Martin Logan Vantage--*Help*

*deleted*
Last edited by BillD on Wed Jun 08, 2011 2:40 pm, edited 1 time in total.
It should sound like it isn't there!
There is a difference between hearing and listening...
Making life enjoyable through expensive electronics.
_________________
Carver: C-4000 & C-1 preamps, PSC-60 preamp/tuner, TX-11a tuner, M-400 (2), C-500, M-500, M-500t, M-500t Mk.II, A-500x, AL-III loudspeakers (2 pr.)
Sunfire:Theater Grand III processor, Ultimate Receiver, Cinema Grand Signature 400 ~ seven, True Subwoofer Mk. II, D-10 Subwoofer
<<

BillD

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(pair of) SILVER-7 TUBE AMPs

Posts: 7295

Joined: Wed Jun 06, 2007 8:29 pm

Location: The west's most mid-western town, Scottsdale, Arizona

Post Wed Jun 08, 2011 2:40 pm

Re: Carver Plats vs. Martin Logan Vantage--*Help*

Don wrote:One of these days I am going to talk Bill D. into sending me a Legacy Marquis HD center channel to compare against my Plats if we can sharpen the pencil enough. If I like the blend of the Marquis HD center channel with my Whisper XD's over the Plats, I will keep you in mind. It is very hard to part with a family member that has been so good to me over the years. I suspect The Marquis HD will have a tall order.

http://www.legacyaudio.com/index.php?It ... item_id=11

Don
I think you've got the wrong guy. I wish I had the Legacy as a center, though. Maybe there's another Bill D. around. Maybe at Legacy?
It should sound like it isn't there!
There is a difference between hearing and listening...
Making life enjoyable through expensive electronics.
_________________
Carver: C-4000 & C-1 preamps, PSC-60 preamp/tuner, TX-11a tuner, M-400 (2), C-500, M-500, M-500t, M-500t Mk.II, A-500x, AL-III loudspeakers (2 pr.)
Sunfire:Theater Grand III processor, Ultimate Receiver, Cinema Grand Signature 400 ~ seven, True Subwoofer Mk. II, D-10 Subwoofer
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